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Full Version: 3sgte v.s SR20DET
6G Celicas Forums > 6th Generation Celica > Engine/Transmission/Maintenance
0Re0
3S v.s SR
chucho
2 bad the 3SGTE doesnt come w/ the CT26 stock rolleyes.gif
Supersprynt
are u joking? the 3sgte does come with the ct26 stock...
OrbitalGT95
that whole post depends on which gen sr20 and which gen 3s they are talking about..an s13 sr vs a 3s..**** the 3s would destroy it, s14 sr vs 3s, that is a damn good race...and s15 sr, which my budy has in his s14, would piss on the 3s...all this is coming from someone who has riden in both a 3s powered car and an sr powered car

Now the 3rd gen 3s..would rap every sr except maybe the s15
dstrbcelica
meh..i would still take teh 3s

-dstrb
x_itchy_b_x
my buddys sr20 runs 12.5s.. with nothing but more boost, fuel and lightened fly wheel and clutch. no internals. its a fast car. id have to see a real 3sgte to make a decsion.
Kwanza26
The 3SGTE is a far better design and is a race proven engine... the SR20 is more or less a cult drift motor... both are strong, but the 3SGTE is a bit better... IMO.
DamDirtyApes
it seems like they know hardly anything about the 3sgte over there

thats a CT26 turbo off a Diesel Toyota engine on that 3S-GTE, its not stock ... what was that supposed to mean
chucho
QUOTE(Supersprynt @ Nov 14, 2004 - 9:23 AM)
are u joking?  the 3sgte does come with the ct26 stock...
[right][snapback]206424[/snapback][/right]

I was wink.gif
LatinKraze
Lmao, damn people. It specifically asked not to vote unless you have knowledge on both engines. Dude on there said sumthing like, I voted SR20DET because i dont know anything about the 3S-GTE. Biased mofos.

I have noticed that people here are less biased than people in other car forums. Am i right or is it because im biased as well?
Consynx
it's the same here as there, just the people here that are like that tend not to post because they'll get SCHOOLED by their own tongue.gif

that being said, i vote 3S because it's toyota smile.gif


actually, i can't exactly tell, the SR comes with the better turbo, and i've heard all sorts of different #s for max attainable power w/ stock internals.

SR20 people way like 6XXhp
and 3S people say like 350-450 (if memory serves right)

how stock internals can hangly 600+hp when it still have 8,5 compression(meaning high boost/revs, is way beyond me)
OrbitalGT95
my buddys 240 powered by an s15 engine is around 430hp
Consynx
wheels or crank

and does he have any reliability issues, or can is it his only car, and he gets to drive it whenever he wants
d3monc3lica
i have a buddy that has a little green nissan pickup pushing 618hp to the wheels with the SR20DET, pretty sick, i do have pics if anyone wants em....
Consynx
of course we want pics, but most importantly is he still using stock internals
recneps
QUOTE
SR20 people way like 6XXhp
and 3S people say like 350-450 (if memory serves right)


i see the 3s putting out way more than 450hp i mean what does trd do when they build a all out racing supra, they put a 3s in it.

i see a 2.2l 3s with a much bigger turbo, good mangement, good fuel, over bored, and well TONS of boost putting out over 600hp maybe more.
Consynx
but i dont want just brute power, i want RELIABLE power.
so 600hp doesn't mean anything if it barely lasts long enough to make it to a meet 2 hrs away.
chucho
1982 Corolla
BEST ET: 7.89s
Engine: Toy. 2.2L 3SGTE inline-4
Horsepower: 900whp

'nuff said

& I've seen the guy on TV before and they got more horsepower out the engine but 'cause of wheel hop or something it wasnt running as fast so they brought it back down to 900
recneps
QUOTE
but i dont want just brute power, i want RELIABLE power.
so 600hp doesn't mean anything if it barely lasts long enough to make it to a meet 2 hrs away.


of couse, but name any 2.0l engine that is going to do 600+hp reliably.
saleeka
Weren't these motors designed for different purposes as well? The 3S-GTE was designed for the soul purpose of being a good rally car motor, being based upon an already competent motor, the 3S-GE. This explains why a stock GTE's internals were not built up to handle massivly high amouts of horsepower- 300 bhp is the limit in the WRC, so there isnt need to be able to handle 500 hp and add weight by making the motor stronger than it needs to be. The SR's purpose, as i'm aware, wasnt to go race, but to lay down in the street and be produced in significant numbers for the S cars. Nissan's rally experence with the SR20-DET motor in the Pulsar GTI-R was not favorable, to say the least, because the engine was prone to overheating issues, and it was not comparable to the reliability of the Toyota by a long shot- and rememebr thats at running 300 hp, not 500. If you ask me, i think the 3S is the better motor simply because of rallying results- It proved itself in the WRC to be superior to the SR.
Consynx
QUOTE(recneps @ Nov 14, 2004 - 10:00 PM)
QUOTE
but i dont want just brute power, i want RELIABLE power.
so 600hp doesn't mean anything if it barely lasts long enough to make it to a meet 2 hrs away.


of couse, but name any 2.0l engine that is going to do 600+hp reliably.
[right][snapback]206777[/snapback][/right]

There is non, that is what im trying to point out.
i don't want these stupid 600hp numbers, i want numbers that were attainable and ran almost daily for several months.
with all these 600hp SR20s, well it just makes me pissed, because i know those internals can not handle that kind of power constantly.
im not saying the 3S can, but i mean...

i was reliable #'s
the 3S SHOULD be around 450 IMO of reliable power; no problems, running happy.
the SR20, well...i believe 500ish should be a good number for it, but i dont know how reliable it is at that point...check that florida company that does the 3S swap, they had some top-of-the-line kit for the SR20 that put out some good power.
Yota
I have heard that 3SGTEs go through head gaskets alot. I've read that in almost every MR2 that competes in the USCC from Sport Compact Car. then on the sr forums they were talking about that as well.

So, does the 3SGTE go through head gaskets as often as they say they do? What can be done to help prevent that besides having a collection of new head gaskets waiting to be replaced?
recneps
QUOTE
I have heard that 3SGTEs go through head gaskets alot. I've read that in almost every MR2 that competes in the USCC from Sport Compact Car. then on the sr forums they were talking about that as well.

So, does the 3SGTE go through head gaskets as often as they say they do? What can be done to help prevent that besides having a collection of new head gaskets waiting to be replaced?


yeah they were talking about this exact same thing in the sr20 forum i have also heard this.

the 3sgte is not as reliable of a motor as many people think it is. i mean of course the mr2 guys run 15lbs daily. but the ct26's really like to go. and hear a lot of stuff about the piston rings nto seating right and just kinda doing whatever they feel like. also the bgearing are known to spin. i mean i cant see any car running 20lbs daily (what would be need for the 3s to make 450hp) be reliable.
CheesyLobster
Doesn't the evo run at over 20 psi stock?
recneps
QUOTE
Doesn't the evo run at over 20 psi stock?


yeah i think stock boost for the evo 8 is like 19lbs. which is a good point. but the Mitsubishi TD05HRA-16G6-9.8T isnt a big turbo. and in all honesty the evolutions intercooler system is much mroe efective than the 3s's.

but in all honesty i dont know how they do it. i mean the 4g63 is a good motor but its no 3s. in fact they are both comparable until you get down to the details iron block, alum head. i mean if the 3s's turbo could hold 20 lbs it would also make 276hp, easy.
uzthedentist
sr20 is a decent engine. However its never been used in a car thats won a world championship. By this i mean wrc, world touring cars, gt, the 3sgte has been used to great effect in the wrc as we know.

The only prob is that the argument means people will end up comparing cars, like this:

QUOTE
that whole post depends on which gen sr20 and which gen 3s they are talking about..an s13 sr vs a 3s..**** the 3s would destroy it, s14 sr vs 3s, that is a damn good race...and s15 sr, which my budy has in his s14, would piss on the 3s...all this is coming from someone who has riden in both a 3s powered car and an sr powered car


would you like to see how a gt4 destroys a n s14?? lol
shin
i'll love to see that uzthedentist, got any videos of it? biggrin.gif
DG_Performance
I am not 100% sure but .....i think info is as follows.
the first gen 3sgte compression ratio is, ???
the second gen 3sgte is, 8.8:1
the third gen 3sgte is, 8.5:1
mmerical
hey there,

1st gen 3sgte compression ratio is 8.5:1

matt
ghostdog
QUOTE(saleeka @ Nov 15, 2004 - 1:12 AM)
Weren't these motors designed for different purposes as well? The 3S-GTE was designed for the soul purpose of being a good rally car motor, being based upon an already competent motor, the 3S-GE. This explains why a stock GTE's internals were not built up to handle massivly high amouts of horsepower- 300 bhp is the limit in the WRC, so there isnt need to be able to handle 500 hp and add weight by making the motor stronger than it needs to be. The SR's purpose, as i'm aware, wasnt to go race, but to lay down in the street and be produced in significant numbers for the S cars. Nissan's rally experence with the SR20-DET motor in the Pulsar GTI-R was not favorable, to say the least, because the engine was prone to overheating issues, and it was not comparable to the reliability of the Toyota by a long shot- and rememebr thats at running 300 hp, not 500. If you ask me, i think the 3S is the better motor simply because of rallying results- It proved itself in the WRC to be superior to the SR.
[right][snapback]206781[/snapback][/right]


I agree. good logic smile.gif
Consynx
haha, they closed it...and i didn't even get to point out when the CT20b came frown.gif
i may be low-knowledge on the 3S(since i dont have one), but i still seem to know as-much as as those guys, and maybe more.

The only reason the 3S isn't even seen the same everywhere is it's aftermarket
you look at a 3S next to a SR20, and the SR20 will ALWAYS be cheaper to make fast. it's the popularity mainly(at least i think so)

and i still want pics of that 240, not only for proof, but it sounds amazing if it's true.
macavely
both great engines.. but... asking which one is better.. is like asking what fruit is better to eat... everyone the answer would be diffrenet depending on what you need... for most people on this site.. the 3sgte would be better.. on that other board.. the SR20 would be... if both engines where as good as they are... they wouldn't have been used for what they are used for..
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