3sgte stroker, i finally decided on my spare 3sgte... Options

[thedevilmaycrie]

im thinkin on making my spare 3sgte a stroker input please...

how do you build these with 5sfe... is it the 3sgte block, rods and pistons w/ a 5sfe crank shaved down?

-DMC

[Junior]

3s block with 5sfe crank, rods, and pistons. There are 3sgte stroker kits in the market.

[thedevilmaycrie]

yeah but making one is cheaper

-DMC

[Supersprynt]

Jun makes a 2.2L for 3400

[1bwilson]

Its 5sfe block, rods,crank,pistons.
3sgte head, cams, intake manifold.....

You may have to drill out the some water jackets depending on the gen 5sfe block.

[shid]

Jun makes a 2.2L for 3400
[right][snapback]225656[/snapback][/right]

Yeah, I'd say his plan is cheaper. A lot cheaper.

[Punch]

If you do it this is the best way to go 3sgte head & pistons
5sfe block, crank & rods this is the cheapest way & all your parts are stock!

[1bwilson]

If you do it  this is the best way to go 3sgte head & pistons
5sfe block, crank & rods this is the cheapest way & all your parts are stock!
[right][snapback]226194[/snapback][/right]

Think about it. 3s pistons are so much cheaper than 5s ones. If they fit the 5s block everyone would have either upgraded to stock or forged 3sgte pistons. Im fairly sure the 3s pistons will not fit. Maybe with the 3s head it'll work but Im still very unsure.

I however know for a fact that 5s pistons and 3s rods fit with no problem. The crank jurnals have to be turned down a bit but that is all.

[Junior]

people, do some research. It is not easy to fit a 3s head on a 5s block. Further more, the 5s has a bigger bore and a longer stroke than the 3s. Hence to bore and stroke a 3s would require the changing of the pistons (bore) and changing of the crank and rods (stroke). You could fit stock 5s crank, rods and pistons. Spend the extra money and get better rods and pistons and use a 5s crank. Make sure to get it all balanced before install. Don't forget you'll have to get a machine shop to bore out the 3s a little.

[FallenHero]

www.club4ag.com


go to tech and then look under 7ag/5ag info

[celica3sgte]

I think Junior hit this one on the nose. lol. The 5s is a 2.2 liter and the 3s is a 2.0 liter. Go get the stroker kit. Even if you bore out the 3s block to be a 2.2 liter, the 5s rods aren't going to hold big amounts of boost.

[Kwanza26]

I think Junior hit this one on the nose. lol.  The 5s is a 2.2 liter and the 3s is a 2.0 liter.  Go get the stroker kit.  Even if you bore out the 3s block to be a 2.2 liter, the 5s rods aren't going to hold big amounts of boost.
[right][snapback]227088[/snapback][/right]

Junior and yourself actually have it the hard way. Not incorrect... but just mis-interpreted. There are versions of the 5S block that you can simply mate up the 3SG head to. Regardless of bore differences, so long as a proper head gasket is used, like an overbored 3SG gasket, it'll be fine. You can't bore out the 3SG block too much, nor can you drop in the 5S crank without some machining. I doubt the 5S crank and fit in the 3S block without some machining. From there, even with the stock 5S bottom, mild boost can be applied so long as the tuning is good. Stroking with the 5S bottom-end will be a whole lot cheaper than buying an aftermarket stroker kit for the 3SG.

[Punch]

I have a stock 5s block that I took apart a some 3s pistons that came across in the shop I just got a 3sgte head , when I get some time to go down there I will try everything too make sure; but the pistons are the same size they fit the rods

This post has been edited by Punch: Dec 27, 2004 - 11:55 PM

[Junior]

If you look at the specs for the 5sfe and 3sgte the differences in the lower end is the bore and stroke length. The bore difference is 1 or 2 mm. The main reason the 5s has a larger displacement is due to the stroke length. From what I know, from research done in the past, the 5s crank will fit right in. Its been debated, check the MR-2 forums, whether or not a 3s head can be mated with a 5s block. It can be done, but its not worth it.

[Kwanza26]

If you look at the specs for the 5sfe and 3sgte the differences in the lower end is the bore and stroke length.  The bore difference is 1 or 2 mm.  The main reason the 5s has a larger displacement is due to the stroke length.  From what I know, from research done in the past, the 5s crank will fit right in.  Its been debated, check the MR-2 forums, whether or not a 3s head can be mated with a 5s block.  It can be done, but its not worth it.
[right][snapback]227370[/snapback][/right]

I really doubt the 5S crank will simply drop in. The 5S crank is pretty big compared to the 3S... but whatever. Nothing against the MR-2 guys, but they're also the guys who claimed to have used S2000 shimless buckets to do shimless conversions on 5SFE's... when in fact, the S2000 doesn't even use buckets/shims... so don't take what they say as the gospel truth...

IMO, the 3SG base is far better anyway. Unless you're doing an all out drag motor with big torque as the goal, the 3SG is a perfect squared motor with some of the toughest factory rods... and the 5S bottom-end just can't match that without a lot of custom work.

[thedevilmaycrie]

geez nm to much trouble imo i think ill just give the 3s away... and no YOU cant have it...

-DMC

This post has been edited by thedevilmaycrie: Dec 28, 2004 - 3:12 PM

[Supersprynt]

can i have it?

[thedevilmaycrie]

sry shes already spoken for... as long as he buys a gt...

-DMC

This post has been edited by thedevilmaycrie: Dec 28, 2004 - 3:33 PM

[Junior]

I don't think people realize that a 2.2 stroker kit for the 3sgte has the same specs as a 5sfe pistons/crank/rods.

[Kwanza26]

I don't think people realize that a 2.2 stroker kit for the 3sgte has the same specs as a 5sfe pistons/crank/rods.
[right][snapback]227938[/snapback][/right]

Proof is better than assumption... but until some proof is provided... I'll stick to my gut.

[Junior]

what dictates the displacement of a motor? Its bore and stroke. If you look at the specs for the stroker kits on the market you'll see the bore and the stroke are identical to that of a 5sfe.

[Punch]

it's been done look here
it's been done if I get the parts & money I will do the same thing

[1bwilson]

it's been done  look here
it's been done  if I get the parts & money I will do the same thing
[right][snapback]228067[/snapback][/right]

Chris K is who I got my pistons and rings from. Hes a VERY nice guy and is willing to go above and beond to help anyone out. My shop stayed in touch with him to keep my crank machined to his specs while installing my rods and pistons.

[Kwanza26]

what dictates the displacement of a motor?  Its bore and stroke.  If you look at the specs for the stroker kits on the market you'll see the bore and the stroke are identical to that of a 5sfe.
[right][snapback]228045[/snapback][/right]

That's not what I meant. You said rods/crank/pistons are the same. I highly doubt that. I doubt the crank journals are the same (5SFE vs JUN stroker), I doubt the rods are the size/length, I doubt the actual bores are the same, the 5SFE being an odd number (87.5mm). I honestly am not even sure if the 3SGTE piston pins are the same as the 5SFE (press fit). Again I'll say, I'll stick to my gut. Stroking with a stroker kit that costs more than the swap itself, or is the cost of 2-3 spare longblocks... just doesn't make sense... because the torque advantage just isn't that great.

[Punch]

I will do it to since you know him how can I get in touch with him???

[1bwilson]

I will do it to since you know him how can I get in touch with him???
[right][snapback]228628[/snapback][/right]

I dont think I have his email or his phone number any longer. Just create a post about him at MR2OC and he will show up. That will most likly be quicker than me finding the recepts.

[Punch]

ok cool!!!

[Punch]

i did this set up with all stock parts an the car runs nows

[6strngs]

http://www.atsracing.net/strokershortblock.htm

[Punch]

ATS Racing 2.2 Stroker

There is no replacement for displacement. By adding approximately 10% more displacement to the original MR2 engine customers are finding much quicker turbo spool up, better driveability, wider torque curves, and excellent low rpm response. The ATS 2.2 stroker short block is built from a 3SGTE block so there is no additional fabrication required for installation. All accessories, oil and water lines bolt up just like factory. Each 2.2 stroker short block includes:

3SGTE cylinder block - bored, checked, decked as necessary

5SFE crankshaft - machined to accept 3SGTE connecting rods. Cryogenically treated for strength and hardness.

Reconditioned 3SGTE rods

[igotocostco]

How much did the stroker kit cost you, Punch? Would like to hear about it. Don't think any of you remember me but I once came here a few months ago looking to buy a Celica, asking a billion questions... now I'm looking for an MR2. I drive an Integra for now (I know.... GTFO Honda!)

Sorry for the thread hijack... anyways just wanted to know how much it cost for the kit? Couldn't find it anywhere on that Aaron guy's page.

[6strngs]

How much did the stroker kit cost you, Punch? Would like to hear about it. Don't think any of you remember me but I once came here a few months ago looking to buy a Celica, asking a billion questions... now I'm looking for an MR2. I drive an Integra for now (I know.... GTFO Honda!)

Sorry for the thread hijack... anyways just wanted to know how much it cost for the kit? Couldn't find it anywhere on that Aaron guy's page.

http://www.atsracing.net/strokershortblock.htm

it says "Prices from $2300"

[94_c3lica_gt]

I'm dealing with this exact same debate with myself as i type this. The 5s has too high of a comp ratio to boost very much past stock 3s if even that. the work and cost it would take to build a 5s-gte hybrid engine would be astounding, and i'm not saying it wouldn't be possible or that it wouldnt be good, it's just that you're basically building an all engine car that you end up turboing in the end. if you machined all of the parts precisely to their potential and tuned the engine right, it would produce a fair amount of hp and tq. but unless you go stock engine components, the bill for the rods, pistons,(which a company called JE makes for the 5sfe block with 3sgte head) head (incl cams, gears, valvetrain etc) would be at LEAST 5grand for good parts. I've decided the best way for me to go, and that's primarily for my use of the car and budget, is to swap the whole shibang out for a 3sgte which goes in almost perfectly bc the all-trac gt4 is virtually the same car with a factory 3sgte and awd. I need to get a 5 speed manual tranny in mine also the pansy i bought it from had a 3spd auto .....*crickets chirping* *wolves howl* *tumbleweed bounces by*. it is ok until around 90mph then it almost loses all power bc the 3rd spd redlines and the engine forcibly kicks in o.d. which has almost no power since it is designed for economy and low rpm travel. i got a quote from a garage where i live to have a full 3sgte swap incl labor and all parts for $4500-$4700 depending on labor but everything i've seen heard and read says it goes in the st202 bay very easily

This post has been edited by 94_c3lica_gt: Nov 20, 2007 - 11:21 PM

[Kadett]

The 5S-FE has a 87mm bore x 91mm stroke = total displacement 2164cm2
The 3S-GTE has a 86mm bore and stroke = total displacement 1998cm2

According to this site: http://www.junauto.co.jp/products/cylinder...aft/3sg.html?en

Jun stroker kit have a 87mm bore x 92mm stroke = total displacement 2188cm2

[taibones]

https://www.rhdjapan.com/home/products/prod...product_id=3765
this is about the best deal on a stroker kit you will find

This post has been edited by taibones: Mar 2, 2008 - 4:22 PM

[jazzcornet]

i am a die hard MR2 guy and i can tell you from copious amounts of experience that the 5s block does mate with the 3s head. TTE 1.2mm metal head gasket and ARP hardware FTW!!! the 5s crank is way beefier than the 3s crank but it would be wise to use 3s rods and pistons. 5s rods and pistons can be used, but they dont stand up to the rigors of 20+psi.

[Punch]

wow this is still talked about....
look all the guys runing 9-8-7 sec rwd 1.8 corolla wit a 3s has 5s blocks and cranks. the whole 5s block 3s head been going on for a long time they get pistons and rods for the 5s (raceeng.com) the set up cost less than a stroker kit! o! always use a turbo oil pump...