2.4L 2ZZ-GE, Can you? Options

[JoKeRkId613]

Okay, my brother has a Scion tC. 2.4L 2AZ-FE. Is it possible to put the GE head from a 1.8L 2ZZ-GE Celica GT-S? That way, it would be a 2.4L 2ZZ-GE. I know it's not the same series but I figure the AZ and the ZZ are similar. I'm guessing you can't. Let me know what you guys think. If you can't, then please tell me why. Thanks.

I know this really has nothing to do with a 6GC. But my brother wanted to know. It's a Toyota engine and I mentioned a Celica. Lol. I know you guys know a lot about hybrid engines and things because of the 7A-GE but this one's more complicated. Thanks.

[FallenHero]

somehow I doubt it.kinda like placind a 7afe head ona 2azfe. The bore to bore spacing alone would be Crazy different from 2zz to 2az. That said, you can probably get the dimensions and such of the 2zz head from www.newcelica.org...

[Kwanza26]

No... stop asking these dumb questions if you don't know anything about engines. Can't just cut-paste good parts to make some sort of fantasy engine...

[JoKeRkId613]

Okay, sorry Kwanza. I'm not going to post anymore then. Thanks.

I said it's a dumb question if you're a mechanic. I'm not a mechanic, so that's why I asked. You get so offended by everything. Sorry not everyone's as smart as you. I'm only 18 and I didn't grow up around cars or read about it as much as you.

[Kwanza26]

That's not even the point... there's simply no logic to your reasoning... I doubt many people here are mechanics or have grown up around engines. I am one of the few, but I tell you what... I rarely answer indirect questions unless they annoy me. This one just happens to be annoying.

[JoKeRkId613]

Then don't reply next time if it annoys you.

[darksecret]

Alright, the motors are very different and I won't give any technical info being that i've never seen either stripped, consider this and your question will be answered, look at the bolt pattern on the head of both motors, if they are different then I wouldn't even bother trying to fit it, if they are the same then it could be probable yet that would open a lot more questions.
BTW I have grown up around motors, domestic yes, but motors still. I hear questions like can I put a Vortec head on my '88 350? Well yes but you'll need a new intake manifold also and only on '88-'95 blocks, unless you want aftermarket heads.

This post has been edited by darksecret: Jul 24, 2005 - 10:22 PM

[FallenHero]

the 2zz has virtually no space from bore to bore... and it has 82mm bore at that... so there is no way a 2.4ltr engines block would be tiny enough to fit a 2zz head.... there is not way. Sorry. The most radical thing I have ever heard of along these lines is that the 1zzfe crank will fit a 7afe with a bit of machining... and this would give the 7a Huge stroke. But, even if you could work out the flywheel, crank pully, etc. why would you sacrifice all your top end for a bit of torque?

Bottom line, won't work. The two engines are just.. so radically different. Buy a nitrous kit and be happy.

[Kwanza26]

Then don't reply next time if it annoys you.
[right][snapback]316373[/snapback][/right]

Sometimes you have a scab and you just gotta pick at it ya know...

[jayi12-15psi]

maybe someone should pick at you...

[Kwanza26]

maybe someone should pick at you...
[right][snapback]316441[/snapback][/right]

I welcome it for a change... Maybe I'll make a topic to set myself up.

[jayi12-15psi]

That would be a waste of space, not quite the same as his question. He was seeking a legitimate answer to a question that is not so stupid for most people.

Everyone realizes that you are a master mechanic, get over yourself.
Try being a little more friendly and humble yourself.

If you cant help someone in a friendly way, leave or silence yourself.

Don't you think I get bored of novice questions? I do, but I keep my mouth shut. Take a lesson.

[Kwanza26]

That would be a waste of space, not quite the same as his question.  He was seeking a legitimate answer to a question that is not so stupid for most people.

Everyone realizes that you are a master mechanic, get over yourself.
Try being a little more friendly and humble yourself.

If you cant help someone in a friendly way, leave or silence yourself.

Don't you think I get bored of novice questions?  I do, but I keep my mouth shut.  Take a lesson.
[right][snapback]316450[/snapback][/right]

You're entitled to your opinion. The people who do discuss things with me regularly understand where I come from. I just don't entertain people's wet dream ideas nor do I care what people think of me. If you call that being arrogant and unkind... fine. I guess I am. It's no big deal to me. I'm just being honest with people... rather than being *nice*. The way I see it, every question has a simple answer. People just gotta stop and think a second before they act. The people who think less and try to over extend end up like this. I could give all sorts of examples... but it would serve no purpose besides a little bit of entertainment (for both of us I'd reckon).

As for help... we all define help in different ways. Sometimes tough love is more helpful than being nice and soft. Very little words are needed with tough love, and the answer is concrete and final.

[presure2]

i think EVERYONE in this conve needs to step back nad STFU.
yea, the guy had a duymb question, it was answered, now let it die. like it should.

[BlackSTX]

I don't think it was a dumb question. There's no such thing as a dumb question. He just didn't know what he was talking about. That's why he was asking the question: to find out. Now he knows. All of us at one point asked questions. That's how you find things out. Sheesh. Kwanza, I'm sure you didn't pop out of your mama knowing which engine heads match up to which engine blocks. You had to LEARN at some point, and you probably did it by asking questions.

[Consynx]

a b c

This post has been edited by Consynx: Jul 25, 2005 - 10:14 AM

[Consynx]

No... stop asking these dumb questions if you don't know anything about engines.  Can't just cut-paste good parts to make some sort of fantasy engine...
[right][snapback]316360[/snapback][/right]

aren't hondas pretty much this way.

sorry about double post guys, tried quoting w/ the fast reply...failed try #1

[Kwanza26]

aren't hondas pretty much this way.

sorry about double post guys, tried quoting w/ the fast reply...failed try #1
[right][snapback]316547[/snapback][/right]

Hondas are the same as Toyotas... you can't take a K20 head and slap it on a D16 block. That's just dumb... but B16 head to a B18 block is ok... cause it's all B series.

Anyway... hey... I apologize if anyone was offended in the process... but really. If people would put more thought into their questions... they can get good straight answers.

[Consynx]

ah, didn't know they stuck w/in the series
someone was trying to explain to me how to get a 300hp all-motor by swapping some LS w/ other crap + changing pistons...
iunno, i didn't save it on the Brain-Drive.

[Kwanza26]

ah, didn't know they stuck w/in the series
someone was trying to explain to me how to get a 300hp all-motor by swapping some LS w/ other crap + changing pistons...
iunno, i didn't save it on the Brain-Drive.
[right][snapback]316603[/snapback][/right]

Just for future refrence... LS block = B18A/B LSVTEC = LS Block with VTEC head, either B18C or B16 (all B series blocks). That's what Honda people refer to when they talk about frankenstein headswaps with the LS block... I've actually done a few myself with decently good results.

[nik]

aren't hondas pretty much this way.

sorry about double post guys, tried quoting w/ the fast reply...failed try #1
[right][snapback]316547[/snapback][/right]

Hondas are the same as Toyotas... you can't take a K20 head and slap it on a D16 block. That's just dumb... but B16 head to a B18 block is ok... cause it's all B series.

Anyway... hey... I apologize if anyone was offended in the process... but really. If people would put more thought into their questions... they can get good straight answers.
[right][snapback]316584[/snapback][/right]

i would have to agree with bee on this one before you go off and start asking question do the research example the head bolt pattern is a big give away if that dont work then your done. Its a good question to ask after you do the info digging

[nik]

ah, didn't know they stuck w/in the series
someone was trying to explain to me how to get a 300hp all-motor by swapping some LS w/ other crap + changing pistons...
iunno, i didn't save it on the Brain-Drive.
[right][snapback]316603[/snapback][/right]

Just for future refrence... LS block = B18A/B LSVTEC = LS Block with VTEC head, either B18C or B16 (all B series blocks). That's what Honda people refer to when they talk about frankenstein headswaps with the LS block... I've actually done a few myself with decently good results.
[right][snapback]316607[/snapback][/right]

there is a civic sitting in the shop (F2uning) where my motor is. there is a b18c engine turbo pushing out 386whp but he going for 450 at the wheels it was in there getting a different stand alone and adding a bigger oil cooler its a really nice car and thats my goal to try and compete with that guy well atleast get close oh and bee "less talk more work" engine is goin in on August 8th

[celica3sgte]

First off it's not that easy to find bolt patterns on heads and blocks. Kwanza you need to just not post here if you're gonna reply with something like that. This is a FORUM!!! It's made for people to ask questions and obviously you are gonna get people on here who won't know as much as others. Completely uncalled for. But then again I've seen you reply like that many of times I doubt you'll change. Do you feel that you're far superior than anyone on this forum. If you feel that way then why bash someone. Hate to whore up the thread but Kwanza is such a chode.

[JoKeRkId613]

I was just asking because I don't know anything about engines. I've never done engine swaps, heck, I've never personally changed my own oil. The only thing I've done myself on my car is put in new spark plugs, a cold air intake and nitrous. And I didn't even spray at that, just purge. So I wouldn't know to look at the bolt pattern because I don't even know where to start looking. Sorry about that. Coomer should post engine knowledge requirements so that I can know how much knowledge about engines I have to have so that people don't get pissed. Like someone here said, it's a forum.

Kwanza, I used to think you were cool because you knew all these things and I've seen your posts on other topics. But damn, you're a straight up jerk. And if that's not the word, then excuse my french, but you're still an idiot. I don't care how much you know about cars. Your attitude towards things are worse than my neighbor. And that's not a good thing, trust me. You can respond back to this because you are just that sad, but everyone will see that you're an ass. It's like if I'm teaching my sister how to drive and she's never driven before and she asks me what happens if she holds the brake and gas pedal down at the same time and I tell her she's a dumbass for saying that. The kid doesn't know how the brake and accelerater work so I would simply explain to her what would happen and the reason for it.

You know what, forget it, you're an artist and the fifty other careers in your profile. I don't want to make your head bigger than I can see it already is. Good luck.

[Silver94CelicaOw...]

This is disappointing. I'm sorry, but Kwanza....I think this should be your warning of sorts from us all that treating everyone on the forum like an insignificant peon due to your "incredible motor sense" and their obvious goal of "annoying you" is really getting old.

It's good that you think highly enough of yourself to have a clear-cut answer for every question asked in a discussion forum, but I think that you might want to use that knowledge next time to give a well-educated and understandibly reasoned explanation for WHY it won't work if you say it won't.

And sorry to come off like some sort of prick, but its obvious that the situation is detrimental to the common goal of members seeking knowledge on this forum, and perhaps the better method would be to leave all ego aside and give good factual advice to the member if you decide you're calm enough to reply.

[darksecret]

I have to agree with the rest Kwanza, I know my s*** also (you also must consider I work on computers not cars for a living so my memory isn't the best) but wouldn't it have been just as easy to say the head bolts have different patterns and the combustion chamber is way to small on the 2ZZ which could lead to detonation and compression issues. Also you could have explained even though the 2AZ head is an FE head it actually handles boost very well and wouldn't be worth swapping out. I understand where you're coming from but this is the first time this question has been asked so just give a real answer, now if another person comes by next week and ask the same question then give a smart ass response and say search.

[jgreening]

Anyone have a key to lock this thread?

[Consynx]

i've been waiting for one of em to sign on aim.

[playr158]

sorry to say but kwanza just got

and this is a reality check for you that your antics are pissing people off cause you think your motor god.....

imo i like you your a great source of knowledge you just need to learn to share it in a presentable maner with everyone else

[Kwanza26]

First off it's not that easy to find bolt patterns on heads and blocks.  Kwanza you need to just not post here if you're gonna reply with something like that.  This is a FORUM!!!  It's made for people to ask questions and obviously you are gonna get people on here who won't know as much as others.  Completely uncalled for.  But then again I've seen you reply like that many of times I doubt you'll change.  Do you feel that you're far superior than anyone on this forum.  If you feel that way then why bash someone.  Hate to whore up the thread but Kwanza is such a chode.
[right][snapback]316770[/snapback][/right]

Well... like i keep saying... you're entitled to your opinions... however simple they may be. It's not even a superiority complex... because I like things short and sweet, and I could care less what people think. As far as heads and blocks go... like mentioned who knows how many countless times before... it's a matter of looking before you leap. The Block family codes alone would tell any person with common sense which block and head can mate up. Hell, in some cases, even heads from the same family of blocks don't swap over without mods (3SGE heads onto some 5SFE blocks). As for acting like a chode... yeah, I admit I'm not the nicest guy here, willing to entertain people's wild ideas. I'm a realist... what can I say... but I'd hardly say any of my comments are "uncalled for"... at least I haven't resorted to name calling...

I was just asking because I don't know anything about engines. I've never done engine swaps, heck, I've never personally changed my own oil. The only thing I've done myself on my car is put in new spark plugs, a cold air intake and nitrous. And I didn't even spray at that, just purge. So I wouldn't know to look at the bolt pattern because I don't even know where to start looking. Sorry about that. Coomer should post engine knowledge requirements so that I can know how much knowledge about engines I have to have so that people don't get pissed. Like someone here said, it's a forum.

Boy... a renewed sense pride now eh? This is why I'm annoyed. You take a statment and turn it to whatever suits you. As evidence: you made this posting asking a basic question about 7AGE's. Evidently you weren't too sure... and you were told in a blunt fashion, "the whole idea behind a 7AGE conversion is to maintain larger displacement." After that, you were told to do "research"... instead you take that answer and run away with it, as evident here. All you gathered from that topic was "take a high performance head, slap it on a big displacement block and gain best of both worlds." That's the sort of thing that annoys me. You made a problem out of an answer because you didn't research or think about anything beforehand.

Kwanza, I used to think you were cool because you knew all these things and I've seen your posts on other topics. But damn, you're a straight up jerk. And if that's not the word, then excuse my french, but you're still an idiot. I don't care how much you know about cars. Your attitude towards things are worse than my neighbor. And that's not a good thing, trust me. You can respond back to this because you are just that sad, but everyone will see that you're an ass. It's like if I'm teaching my sister how to drive and she's never driven before and she asks me what happens if she holds the brake and gas pedal down at the same time and I tell her she's a dumbass for saying that. The kid doesn't know how the brake and accelerater work so I would simply explain to her what would happen and the reason for it.

Like I said before... I don't really care what you or anyone else thinks of me good or bad. Everyone is on level ground with me. Hell, if tomorrow you have a question and hit me up on AIM... I won't hold anything said here against you. That's not the kinda person I am... and I will respond because I think most people would in effort to defend themselves. At the very least, I'm not gonna call you names.

You know what, forget it, you're an artist and the fifty other careers in your profile. I don't want to make your head bigger than I can see it already is. Good luck.

I'd hardly call them careers... hobbies perhaps. Don't try and get personal either... cause that's barking up the wrong tree.

This is disappointing. I'm sorry, but Kwanza....I think this should be your warning of sorts from us all that treating everyone on the forum like an insignificant peon due to your "incredible motor sense" and their obvious goal of "annoying you" is really getting old.

I don't treat people like that. If that's all you're getting... you're reading the wrong posts. I treat people the way they ask to be treated (not in a literal sense). I don't sugar coat things. If that's too much for you... sorry. If they make an effort to clash with me in a dignified way, I welcome it (fallenhero in the past, darksecret, lagos, supersprynt, just to name a few). As opinionated as each of us were, or as you refer it, high and mighty, there is still general respect. Might seem high and mighty that I would be the one to always catch the most heat, but I always expect it cause I'm not looking to appease people. As for these posts being my warning... I've yet to heed the warning. From my point of view... people will jump at the chance at having a reason to jar with me. Especially those "nice" ones whos think "i'm too mean..."

It's good that you think highly enough of yourself to have a clear-cut answer for every question asked in a discussion forum, but I think that you might want to use that knowledge next time to give a well-educated and understandibly reasoned explanation for WHY it won't work if you say it won't.

Heh... nothing is clear cut, but simple answers are always there. It's not what I think of myself or anyone else... it's common sense. Put some thought into something before hand... you'll be surprised how detailed of answers some of the people here can give. Take for example... I remember giving nik a hard time when he first started asking questions about 7AGTE builds. First his questions were very basic general questions... then as I pushed him... his general questions became specific questions (because unlike some, he listened and researched)... and he got a lot of detailed answers. He too had some pretty interesting ideas, for one, using a B18 turbo manifold on a 4AG head. Most would dismiss that, but because there was a certain logic to his reasoning... and since I had a couple of B18 headers floating around my, I confirmed his idea and it turned out well.

And sorry to come off like some sort of prick, but its obvious that the situation is detrimental to the common goal of members seeking knowledge on this forum, and perhaps the better method would be to leave all ego aside and give good factual advice to the member if you decide you're calm enough to reply.

I'm always calm. I also appreciate your response, because at the very least, you've held your composure and chose not to name-call. It's not even about ego. Ego doesn't have much say when things are really cut and dry, as in this case. I could refrence some past discussions when there was more ego involved... but that wouldn't matter too much. Let's just say... I know where I'm strong, and I know where I'm weak. I wouldn't undermind say, pressure2 or lagos's advice when it comes to boosting... In the end, I treat questions, and/or the people who ask them, the same way as they ask their questions.

Anyway... twas fun. I'm gonna be gone till the weekend... so try not to disappoint.

[Kwanza26]

I have to agree with the rest Kwanza, I know my s*** also (you also must consider I work on computers not cars for a living so my memory isn't the best) but wouldn't it have been just as easy to say the head bolts have different patterns and the combustion chamber is way to small on the 2ZZ which could lead to detonation and compression issues. Also you could have explained even though the 2AZ head is an FE head it actually handles boost very well and wouldn't be worth swapping out. I understand where you're coming from but this is the first time this question has been asked so just give a real answer, now if another person comes by next week and ask the same question then give a smart ass response and say search.
[right][snapback]316901[/snapback][/right]

I've explained why I'm annoyed below... I think fi you were in my shoes... you would be too. Can't say whether you'd act out on it or not...

[Kwanza26]

sorry to say but kwanza just got

and this is a reality check for you that your antics are pissing people off cause you think your motor god.....

imo i like you your a great source of knowledge you just need to learn to share it in a presentable maner with everyone else
[right][snapback]316917[/snapback][/right]

Heh... hardly owned. I've had worst. If I thought I was a motor god... wouldn't I jump at the chance to impress everyone with my awesome knowledge? Hardly. If you think my antics are pissing people off... I must be in deep sh!t huh? Heh... funny that comes from you of all people...

[celica3sgte]

If you are that annoyed then don't come on here.

[Consynx]

sweet.
a 100page ownage thread on 6gc, lol

j/k obviously.
btw, if i even get any crap for posting this...
gotta love it "chode"

[presure2]

GOD SOMEONE PLEASE KILL THIS THREAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[playr158]

*bang bang*

this shizoo is official KILLED

[Consynx]

Noo, ghost is here

[Consynx]

just kidding, i love ya

[playr158]

dun dun dunnnnnnnnnnn

1