FIRST B-SERIES MANI USED, FIRST TO USE Options

[Clement]

I JUST GOT DONE BLOWEN UP AND DOWN THE STREETS OF JERSEY WITH THE B-SERIES MANIFOLD ON MY CAR WILL POST PICS LATER IF WANNA SEE AND YOUR IN JERSEY PM ME......

[playr158]

weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

mike's my hero....i can't wait to see it in person!



This post has been edited by presure2: Aug 6, 2005 - 10:43 AM

[97sccelica]

is this a header, or a turbo manifold?

[Blakout16]

im pretty sure its a header.

[playr158]

ITS A TURBO MANIFOLD..........

This post has been edited by presure2: Aug 6, 2005 - 10:43 AM

[Blakout16]

so that means he has a turbo? he didnt update his profile...

[dustin15brown]

ehh who cares if he updated... I wanna see pics.... Now explain to me what the advantage of using a Honda manifold is?

[97sccelica]

ehh who cares if he updated... I wanna see pics.... Now explain to me what the advantage of using a Honda manifold is?
[right][snapback]319453[/snapback][/right]

they are every where, cheap, and tubular

[nik]

where did you get that idea to use a b-series manifold j/k lets see some pics

[dustin15brown]

ehh who cares if he updated... I wanna see pics.... Now explain to me what the advantage of using a Honda manifold is?
[right][snapback]319453[/snapback][/right]

they are every where, cheap, and tubular
[right][snapback]319497[/snapback][/right]

tubular?

[nik]

ehh who cares if he updated... I wanna see pics.... Now explain to me what the advantage of using a Honda manifold is?
[right][snapback]319453[/snapback][/right]

they are every where, cheap, and tubular
[right][snapback]319497[/snapback][/right]

tubular?
[right][snapback]319503[/snapback][/right]

here i'll help out because i'm the only one right now with pics of the manifold


this is my b-series mani for my 7agte


and this was my log style jgstools manifold for my 7afte

[[Freemantle]]

Eeeeh, a 7afe isn't going to benifit terribly from a tubular manifold. Cheap is the main beni from being able to use a b-series manifold, such as a BLOX manifold, or the sexiest $300 manifold alive at Slowboy Racing.

Edit: SSAutochrome = bad the manifold in the above picture resembles it

This post has been edited by [Freemantle]: Aug 2, 2005 - 12:16 PM

[nik]

Edit: SSAutochrome = bad the manifold in the above picture resembles it
[right][snapback]319511[/snapback][/right]

I was waiting for that anyways yes its a ssautochrome manifold. This is why because i was the first to try this style of conversion in a Celica i was not going to buy a $600 manifold and cut it up to find out it wouldnt work 90% of all the original welds have been redone and yes i've heard all the horror stories if it breaks or cracks i'll buy a new better manifold to cut up anymore questions?

[playr158]

nik your only the first with a picture.....

he actually has it on his celica with a turbo on it and working

but credit for the idea does go to you

[nik]

nik your only the first with a picture.....

he actually has it on his celica with a turbo on it and working 

but credit for the idea does go to you
[right][snapback]319537[/snapback][/right]

actually his the first to do it on 7afte i'll just be the first to do it on a 7agte
but who really cares i was trying to justify why i used a SSautochrome manifold and if you want to trick out your celica you have to start thinking out side the box i have a few more secert products for the 7agte in store with help of some honda products

but i wont take all the credit bee help me out and some guys from club4ag.com

[playr158]

" his celica "

i just said celica

but yea i agree wiht your usage of the ssautochrome
personally i'm goin to use the OBX

[FallenHero]

but i wont take all the credit bee help me out
[right][snapback]319540[/snapback][/right]

Yea, the ole boy knows what he's talking about. I have got many a idea from our little discussions in the past.

[Clement]

i will update my profile and have pics like next week i'll be tweekin the car all week until dyno day.....

[Clement]

just to let everyone know the older supra injectors do work they work like a stock turbo car LOL

[doGGy]

Period.

This post has been edited by presure2: Aug 6, 2005 - 10:46 AM

[nik]

there you go Clement

[Clement]

THANK YOU; LOL please no haters ;we weren't tring to just talk i was just slacking i should have taking pics be4 we talked about it!!!

[nik]

now just do all the things we just chatted about

timing
plugs
catch can
etc

side note: i would get one of the bendable hoses so you can go around your wastegate also arent you missing a screaw that goes on top of you wastegate

[playr158]

no he isn't missing a screw thats just the way it is on this one?!



This post has been edited by presure2: Aug 6, 2005 - 10:41 AM

[Clement]

i know i need to find a hose that will work for the radiator

[nik]

i know i need to find a hose that will work for the radiator
[right][snapback]320658[/snapback][/right]

check ebay

[Clement]

what kinda hose do i look for

[playr158]

advanced rad hose same size just find one with a different curve that would go around the gate

[FallenHero]

nice man. is it SSautochrome?

[Clement]

yeah

[Clement]

anyone wanna buy a FMU LOL 12:1

[Kwanza26]

My comments for the owner of that set-up has been said through PM's... cheers

This post has been edited by presure2: Aug 6, 2005 - 10:42 AM

[FallenHero]

what did you do to the manifold to get it that color?

[nik]

what did you do to the manifold to get it that color?
[right][snapback]320706[/snapback][/right]

the heat from the exhaust turns it that color

[nik]

what kinda hose do i look for
[right][snapback]320664[/snapback][/right]

this http://www.coolflex.com/cfm/welcome.cfm




This post has been edited by nik: Aug 4, 2005 - 9:47 PM

[playr158]

and nik comes through with yet 1 more cool toy when will he stop

[FallenHero]

what did you do to the manifold to get it that color?
[right][snapback]320706[/snapback][/right]

the heat from the exhaust turns it that color
[right][snapback]320713[/snapback][/right]

hm, I had no clue. Stainless ehh?

[nik]

and nik comes through with yet 1 more cool toy when will he stop
[right][snapback]320739[/snapback][/right]

yeah i have too much time on my hands

what did you do to the manifold to get it that color?
[right][snapback]320706[/snapback][/right]

the heat from the exhaust turns it that color
[right][snapback]320713[/snapback][/right]

hm, I had no clue. Stainless ehh?
[right][snapback]320784[/snapback][/right]

also wear gloves when installing that manifold the oil from your hands ...after they manifold heats up it will burn the finger print or hand print into it

[presure2]

nice work clement..
i cleaned up the post abit...
i wanna see more pics!
i woulda like to have seen a before/after dyno, but it definetly LOOKS bling!

[playr158]

thats for cleaning manny! your kick'n butt around here

oh update on mike's motor

he's been blowing out some blue smoke (oil)
and needed a catch can....he now has the catch can on BUT yet 1 more issue.....we(he) believes that the turbo seal has been busted on the turbo that i gave him that slipgun gave me....reason being is that oil was blowing out his BOV.....

so right now slipgun is at work but when he gets home is goin to check where the turbo came from and such and find out what we can do and if there is a warrenty on the turbo...

[presure2]

yea, if hes blowing oil out the BOV, its definetly bad.

[nik]

yea, if hes blowing oil out the BOV, its definetly bad.
[right][snapback]321276[/snapback][/right]

i had the same problem but i installed a catch can and had the turbo rebuilt and no more smoke

[CheesyLobster]

This may be a dumb question, but is that an aftermarket map sensor?

[playr158]

is what an aftermarket map sensor?

a BOV = blow off valve = air release
a catch can = catches oil from the release valve (on top end) and drops it into a can instead of recirculating it into the intake....

[1900]

he should do a compression test and check if the piston rings are broken

[playr158]

ummm that wouldn't be the case?

broken rings dont' equal oil out the BOV


that IS a turbo seal.....

[nik]

so whats the update anymore pics ?

[playr158]

not yet

[dustin15brown]

I want more pics!!

[[Freemantle]]

ummm that wouldn't be the case?

broken rings dont' equal oil out the BOV


that IS a turbo seal.....
[right][snapback]322707[/snapback][/right]

Hold your horses. Make sure you a solving the problem and not the symptoms.

A turbo will bleed oil if:

-The return line is not being assisted enough by gravity

-The return line is too small

-The return line is clogged with contamination

-The feed line is too large

-The feed is at too high of a pressure (45~ psi is way too much. Aim for 15-25 psi)

-The turbo spins dry and burns up the seals

I would hate to see you go through all the work of replacing the seals just to have them wash out again.

[playr158]

do you really know what your talking about?

-The return line is not being assisted enough by gravity
an ideal return line should be completely vertical or no more then 30* from vertical this one is less then 30* if not nearly vertical

-The return line is too small
nope return is 10an (standard jgstools)

-The return line is clogged with contamination
brand new

-The feed line is too large
feed line 4an about the right size 3 is ideal

-The feed is at too high of a pressure (45~ psi is way too much. Aim for 15-25 psi)
oil pressure at the turbo should never exceed 65psi thats when damage starts to happen and seals go bad.....45psi is fine a little high but fine

-The turbo spins dry and burns up the seals
well if it was spinning dry it wouldn't spit oil now would it

[nik]

-The turbo spins dry and burns up the seals
well if it was spinning dry it wouldn't spit oil now would it
[right][snapback]323101[/snapback][/right]

i dont know how the turbo was hooked up but its good idea to pull the spark plug wires and crank the car over a few times to pressures the oil line and get the oil moving through the turbo i did this but left the drain line off to make sure oil was going through the turbo

the book helps doesnt player

[slipgun]

did you all follow the instructions with the turbo and stick your fingers in there when you first started it and hold it for a minute till the oil gets in there?

[nik]

did you all follow the instructions with the turbo and stick your fingers in there when you first started it and hold it for a minute till the oil gets in there?
[right][snapback]323126[/snapback][/right]

i did mine while the turbo was setting in the engine bay not hooked to the manifold but i havent heard about holding the compressor wheel

[presure2]

actually, player, everything he said IS true. all those things will make the turbo blow oil past the seals.
your sarcasam does NOTHING for these posts, also.

[playr158]

i never said it wasn't true cause umm i even said that was the issue?!

"that IS a turbo seal"

.....hence the reason why i supplied the piece of information to each of his questions......

the "do you really know what your talking about" was refering to the piston rings making oil come out the BOV.....not physically possible

This post has been edited by playr158: Aug 12, 2005 - 1:47 AM

[lagos]

did you guys ever notice how it seems that almost everyone on here blows their turbo seals on the 1st turbo they install? it seems all too common... there must be a common mistake in the install, oil lines, or something.... dont you guys think?

[nik]

did you guys ever notice how it seems that almost everyone on here blows their turbo seals on the 1st turbo they install?  it seems all too common... there must be a common mistake in the install, oil lines, or something.... dont you guys think?
[right][snapback]323299[/snapback][/right]

i think its the oil pressure from the feed line pushing oil pass the seal but then again not many of us are buying new turbos usally used ones or rebuilt ones on ebay

[Clement]

that just what i was thinking Lagos.......

[1900]

hey your problem might not be broken rings, but when i blew no. 2 piston on my car i got alot of blow by and oil would come out of the bov.

[playr158]

hey your problem  might not be broken rings, but when i blew no. 2 piston on my car i got alot of blow by and oil would come out of the bov.
[right][snapback]323397[/snapback][/right]

dude you can't shoot oil out the BOV from the combustion chamber it defies PHYSICS.....
think if your forcing air INTO the engine....wat makes you think that oil can come out through the intake valve, upstream through the intake runners, and upstream through the intake manifold, out the TB, and down the pipe and out the BOV its physically impossible.....

[nik]

that just what i was thinking Lagos.......  
[right][snapback]323390[/snapback][/right]

not many of the turbo guys are using a catch can for the blow by

This post has been edited by nik: Aug 12, 2005 - 12:07 PM

[playr158]

yea that and is everyones drain lines at the right angles and
lines correct sizes?.......

[lagos]

that just what i was thinking Lagos....... 
[right][snapback]323390[/snapback][/right]

not many of the turbo guys are using a catch can for the blow by
[right][snapback]323409[/snapback][/right]

thats a lot of blowby tho, if your car is smoking. a stock 3s motor dosnt use a catch can and donst have these types of issues. there must be something else at the heart of the problem

[playr158]

lagos its cause the n/a motor design swapped into a turbo isn't designed for the extra pressure and pushes it out more so then say a stock 3s which is designed for such

[nik]

that just what i was thinking Lagos.......  
[right][snapback]323390[/snapback][/right]

not many of the turbo guys are using a catch can for the blow by
[right][snapback]323409[/snapback][/right]

thats a lot of blowby tho, if your car is smoking. a stock 3s motor dosnt use a catch can and donst have these types of issues. there must be something else at the heart of the problem
[right][snapback]323463[/snapback][/right]

lagos its cause the n/a motor design swapped into a turbo isn't designed for the extra pressure and pushes it out more so then say a stock 3s which is designed for such
[right][snapback]323475[/snapback][/right]

ok ok back to the point now are we just talking 7afte or 5sfte also

i guess i can walk back through my install step by step i dont think i forgot anything but you never know and i started with a used turbo from Zipstrips

[lagos]

nik, i saw zipstrips car in action and got a ride in it ...way back in the day. he was blowing lots of blue smoke at the time and had a coke bottle catch can setup....if that helps you any. i think he also said he was on his 2nd or 3rd turbo at the time

[playr158]

ouch that means there is a design flaw in the way we're setting them up

[dustin15brown]

So have you figured it out what was wrong yet?

[Clement]

nik, i saw zipstrips car in action and got a ride in it ...way back in the day. he was blowing lots of blue smoke at the time and had a coke bottle catch can setup....if that helps you any. i think he also said he was on his 2nd or 3rd turbo at the time







that sucks we gots to find out whats goin on....

[lagos]

Clement ..

im no 7a guy....but it looks like you have the valve cover pcv line hooked up directly to your throttle body. that is not correct and would make your car smoke. you need to hook up an intake with 2 niples on it, then hook up the valve cover line and the other line to the intake. then connect the intake to the turbo inlet.

[lagos]

looking at your pic again..... looks like you used part of your injen intake, and have a vac hose (where is that going to?) and temp sensor running to it... if i were you, i would extend the wiring for the temp sensor and route it to measure air between the air filter and the turbo inlet, because the way u have it now could create a big boost leak

[presure2]

if i were you, i would extend the wiring for the temp sensor and route it to measure air between the air filter and the turbo inlet, because the way u have it now could create a big boost leak

actually, art, thats the wrong spot for it.
i havent even looked at his pic, but i can tell you that the right spot for the IAS will be in the intercooler piping, between the intercooler and the T/B.
in the 5s/7a the ecu selects the fuel map by looking at the map sensor and ias, and putting it in the intake pre turbo is gonna give you a false reading.
you want the ECU to see the temp right before it hits the T/B, just like stock.
::edit::
i just looked at the pic, and as long as youve got a solid seal there, (cause art is right, it WILL create a boost leak if you dont seal it well) thats where you want it.

[lagos]

yeah i guess so, but i can see that hole being hard to plug air tight ...and arent the fuel maps under boost controled by the piggy backs people use anyway ?

[presure2]

art, "controled" and piggybacks are 2 words that do not go together.

the piggybacks dont control jack, they just manipulate.
they do nothing to the "fuel maps"
they just modify the signal to the ecu, "tricking" it so to speak.
as for guessing its the right spot, it actually makes sense when you think about it,
if you put the AIS preturbo, your not seeing actual intake temps. the air still has to go thru the turbo, get heated, thru the piping, the intercooler to get cooled, then to the T/B..
you want the ECU to see the temp as close to what it actually is going into the TB, so that it selects the proper fuel map for the temp of the air going in. thats what the IAS job is, to tell the ECU what the intake air temp is.
now, on the 3s, its a whole diffrent story cause of the way the ECU uses the AFM to read airflow..ect

[Clement]

yea i have it sealed really good.... and i was told to leave the pcv where it is and yea in that pic the release valve is just hangin out LOL; but now i have a catch can and i'm waitin for a new turbo to see whats goin on

[lagos]

yeah i know how it all works...lol

what i was trying to say is....
on the 3s, the afm measures intake temp and the amount of air, through the afm, before the turbo. the odd thing is, you would think toyota would want to measure the air after the turbo heats it, but they dont. that leads me to think that the those sensors arent as critical as we think they are. it probably has the range of a narrow band o2 sensor, reading hot or cold... and nothing in between. so, really you should be able to put them just about anywhere and it wouldnt matter much.

i remember the gromet that i had to use for my sensor when i had my injen in there... that thing definetly didnt look like it was air tight..lol

[playr158]

yea art you have to remember 7a is not AFM

so lol its different for us....and trust me it can mess up a decent amount with out that in there post intercooler

[nik]

this is where i put mine right before the throttle after the turbo


and it worked fine

[playr158]

i'd think a rubber grommet and a lil high temp silicone should do you fine

[lagos]

yea art you have to remember 7a is not AFM

so lol its different for us....and trust me it can mess up a decent amount with out that in there post intercooler
[right][snapback]324417[/snapback][/right]

well yeah, doh !

if u can get it sealed up, then its good in the ic piping too. just saying that i dont think it would make a big differnece pre of post turbo ... just my opinion tho

[presure2]

what i was trying to say is....
on the 3s, the afm measures intake temp and the amount of air, through the afm, before the turbo. the odd thing is, you would think toyota would want to measure the air after the turbo heats it, but they dont. that leads me to think that the those sensors arent as critical as we think they are

god art, you are so stubboren sometimes, this is NOT a 3s. the AIS is ALOT more critical to us then what it is to you in your AFM setup.
the 3s setup is NOT like the 5s or 7a setup.
you cant compare the 2.
would you care for me to type out the section in the BGB that explains how it uses the AIS and what the range is, Ect?
trust me, the AIS IS important, ALOT more important to us, than it is to you with the AFM.
that said, a smaller grommet, and some RTV silicone create quite a nice seal
:::EDIT:::
heres the info RIGHT from the BGB:
ECS (Engine Control System)
The control system consists of sensors which detect various engine conditions, and an ECM(ECU) which determine the injection volume (timing) based on the signal from the sensors.
The various sensors detect intake air pressure(MAP), engine speed(RPM), oxygen density in the exhaust gas(O2), INTAKE AIR TEMP(IAT), engine coolant temp.(ECT) and atmospheric pressure ect, and convert the info into an electrical signal which is sent to the ECM(ECU).Based on these signals, the ECM calculates the optimum ignition timing for the current conditions and operates the injectors.

with all the "fooling" the ecu we already do with the safc and map sensor stuff, the LAST thing we need to be doing is giving the ECU more false info.

This post has been edited by presure2: Aug 15, 2005 - 6:14 PM

[lagos]

i guess what i was trying to say might be taken the wrong way ...

i was just saying that was my opinion, that clement could put it in the air intake, before the turbo, because they way he had it in his pic, didnt look air tight.... if u can get an air tight seal in the ic piping, under pressure, then keep it there!

those temp sensors arent all that precise, so it really wouldnt make much of a difference if it went pre or post turbo . all that sensor does (in an afm or map based car) is measure temps from 0 - 176F and converts it to a voltage that ranges from 5v - 0v .

This post has been edited by lagos: Aug 15, 2005 - 8:13 PM

[lagos]

here is some ref info on what all the imput sensors do and how the ecu reads them if anyone wants ... its got some good reading

http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/h24.pdf page 18

[presure2]

art, i knew what you meant, but again, theres a REASON the sensor is there, it DOES matter where it is. if the seal isnt tight, then he needs to figure out a way to MAKE it air tight, not move the sensor to somewhere where its essensially usless.
this is right from your link:
An IA monitor is nessecary in the EFI system because the pressure and density of air changes with temperature. Because air is more dense when cold, the ECU factors AIT into the fuel correction program.

this was exactly my point of why it NEEDS to be in the intercooler piping, post intercooler.

This post has been edited by presure2: Aug 15, 2005 - 8:44 PM

[Clement]

new turbo should be in ANY minute now......