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> BEAMS engine remap for 95 octane, Can it be done?
post Apr 17, 2006 - 8:46 AM
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Dagon

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Hey everyone,

I'm new to the forums. I've done a few searches for info on Beams remaps but have found nothing.

Just about to sell my 94 Red SSI Celica with the 3SFE lump, to get a lovely white SSIII Beams machine!!

My only problem is that over here in Ireland it's hard to get anything other than 95 octane fuel. The Beams really should run on 99RON. I've checked out the option of octane boosters like redex, and they seem cool, but would be expensive in the long run, and their effectiveness is questionable.

So the only other option for me is to remap the engine for 95 octane. However, I know that it's a high compression engine, and am not sure if this is a good idea. Obviously performance will also suffer but I'm not sure by how much.

I'm sure some of the Beams heads on this site will be able to help me with this. Thanks in advance for any help or advice from you fellow Celica nuts biggrin.gif
post Apr 17, 2006 - 9:57 AM
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BLADDER_MASTER

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Your ECU should detect the 95 octane and pull back timing to compensate for it. You should be fine.
post Apr 17, 2006 - 10:07 AM
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Bitter

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what octane numbering system does ireland use at the pump? in the US its PON which is MON+RON/2

91 RON is equiv to 87 PON.

PON=Pump Octane Number
RON=Research Octane Number
MON=Mechanical Octane Number.

a google search should yeild some rough conversion charts.


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post Apr 17, 2006 - 11:33 AM
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Dagon

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QUOTE
Your ECU should detect the 95 octane and pull back timing to compensate for it. You should be fine.


Afraid not. I've checked this out, and it is not a good idea, and ultimately leads to serious wear and tear on engine components (with knocking and pinging), leading to total engine failure in the long term. These engines are very high compression, and long term 95 RON use is not recommended.

As for fuel ratings - in ireland, it is RON I think. Most pumps are 95, but some are 97 and 98 (e.g. Shell Ultimate fuel). However, by and large it's more expensive and harder to find 99 RON unless you live in a large city.

So does anyone know if it's possible to remap the Beams for lower octane/RON fuel?



post Apr 17, 2006 - 12:23 PM
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WannabeGT4



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I doubt you'll find someone to detune your Beams ECU...

You can try retarding your base timing two or three degrees and hope your knock sensor and ECU can make up the difference.

The only other option I can come up with short of lower compression pistons is a thicker head gasket but that's a lot of work just to make your car slower.

If you can't get/afford 98RON you're probably better of with your 3SFE economy motor.

This post has been edited by WannabeGT4: Apr 17, 2006 - 12:24 PM


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post Apr 17, 2006 - 12:40 PM
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Bitter

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next time you're at the pump check what octane rating method they use.

http://www.btinternet.com/~madmole/Reference/RONMONPON.html


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post Apr 17, 2006 - 12:55 PM
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you are whong my mate wink.gif I know a guy localy who is running his Beams almost a year on 95 - and no problem at all. All toyota ECU's are made this way to detect and adobt to the situation and fuel. ofcorse with 98 you will get few more horses, but you can run on 95 without a problem. ECU will retard timing.

My Beams isnt running yet, but i see no problem running on 95.


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post Apr 17, 2006 - 1:44 PM
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Dagon

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Thanks for all the responses guys...

doggy, it really isn't a good idea to run on 95. Sure, it might be fine for a couple of years, but over time he may run into engine problems. Check this:

QUOTE
Robbie from TrackdayPerformance: The engine will detonate on 95 ron fuel. Also it will need to have its ignition map cahnged to run on 95 ron fuel.

Honda V-tec engies will runn for a long time while knocking but after we remap them for no knock they last forever and produce more power as they are optomised for the fuel they are using.

Octane booster will not protect your engine when it was designed for 100+ and you are putting 95 into it.

To remap the toyota we realy need to fit a piggy back or standalone ecu.

drop me an e-mail and i can get some prices to you. robbie@tdp.ie




Thats taken from a thread over on http://www.cruiseirl.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30463
post Apr 18, 2006 - 3:07 PM
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doGGy



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QUOTE(Dagon @ Apr 17, 2006 - 11:44 AM) [snapback]422571[/snapback]

Thanks for all the responses guys...

doggy, it really isn't a good idea to run on 95. Sure, it might be fine for a couple of years, but over time he may run into engine problems. Check this:

QUOTE
Robbie from TrackdayPerformance: The engine will detonate on 95 ron fuel. Also it will need to have its ignition map cahnged to run on 95 ron fuel.

Honda V-tec engies will runn for a long time while knocking but after we remap them for no knock they last forever and produce more power as they are optomised for the fuel they are using.

Octane booster will not protect your engine when it was designed for 100+ and you are putting 95 into it.

To remap the toyota we realy need to fit a piggy back or standalone ecu.

drop me an e-mail and i can get some prices to you. robbie@tdp.ie




Thats taken from a thread over on http://www.cruiseirl.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30463


Well, i really care less about this - cuz im not planing to marrie my car.... Another thing - im planning to run Emanage on the Beams - so i will get to adjust timing and A/F ratio anyway... BTW - if i ran my Turbo setup with CR ratio at 9.5-1 and aint had Knocking issues on 95 - i doubt i will have them with the Beams....


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post Apr 18, 2006 - 3:26 PM
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Dagon

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QUOTE


Well, i really care less about this - cuz im not planing to marrie my car.... Another thing - im planning to run Emanage on the Beams - so i will get to adjust timing and A/F ratio anyway... BTW - if i ran my Turbo setup with CR ratio at 9.5-1 and aint had Knocking issues on 95 - i doubt i will have them with the Beams....


biggrin.gif
I think you're right mate.. I don't plan on marrying her either.. although after driving her for a while it could very well happen wink.gif

I'm going to just forget about it, if I get the car, and run on 95RON!! According to you guys the knock sensor should do the job, and I reckon you know more about this engine than the other people who I've consulted...

So I'm taking your advice, cheers



post Apr 18, 2006 - 4:05 PM
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Can't you add an octane booster to each tankful?
Gary


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post Apr 18, 2006 - 5:06 PM
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Dagon

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QUOTE(GT4WRC @ Apr 18, 2006 - 4:05 PM) [snapback]423109[/snapback]

Can't you add an octane booster to each tankful?
Gary


You could but, after googling around:

"octane boost really works, just not as much as the manufacturers would like for you to believe. Most of them typically advertise that they raise the octane level by 3 to 8 points. This sounds great because most of us typically assume that if a bottle of octane boost is advertised to treat 10 gallons and raise it 5 points, it will turn 91 octane into 96 octane. This is far from the truth. If you read the fine print on most bottles you will find out that a "point" is actually one tenth of an octane, so that same bottle actually is only good for changing your ten gallons of 91 octane in 91.5 octane.
So a point is .1 type of points. A 5 point booster doesn't boost 91 to 96. It boosts it to 91.5. Not worth it.
Very misleading the way they advertise it if you ask me.

Personally I’d stay away from octane boosters. There are a lot of crappy ones that don’t work and the good ones that do are very corrosive to just about everything

plus. octane booster in 2-strokes causes blow by.
"

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