Need a little help, few 5sfte questions Options

[1bwilson]

Okay, some of you may know me and some of you might know of me threw the "Big 5sfte post". Well in actuallity I never actually got the chance to finnish my boost project. Long story short I ran into alot of issues with bad shops doing terrible work causing huge failures on my car during the prep phase. It caused me to do a total ground up rebuild of the block, CP forged pistons, 3sgte rods, ARP head studs, P&P'd head 98' metal head gasket. After it was all said and done between the ruined parts and rebuild I spent the better part of 18 months and over $5k on my motor alone and lost all interest in my car and the project.

Since then in the past 2-3 years of being mia from this site the car has sat most of that time. Ive driven it a total of about 7k miles. The good news is the build is rock solid and Ive gained motovation to build the celica up once again. Also its now just a toy rather then a daily driver so now theres really nothing in the way of this car getting boost. Ive actually already started putting it back togather. I just need a few clarifications as I am very rusty.

Oil lines and relocation, does anyone have any pictures of how they ran both or either. Im using the same earls fitting Manny used and was planning to have the oil filter somewhere near the windshield washer refill tank. Anyone else go this route, if now what would you recomend? Lines, my origional oil lines are the exact lines Nuke used on his first 5sfte (if anyone remembers Nuke from back on the c.net boards), their old and very ghetto rigged <3 Nuke if he reads this . Id like to get the -3an flange welded on and plan to do so. How long of a line is everyone using and what fittings did you need to use to get the best path around the turbo. Any pictures would be great.

Last but never least, I hear the MSD BTM trick isnt that great of a fix, what are the issues? Any fixes out there that I havent seen yet, or is there just no way around a piggy back? If I have to go piggyback once its running im really not upset as id like to make this build a 1 time shot anyway and get it all right the first try. Any good piggybacks out there with a good wideband O2 sensor? If not any good O2's anyone would suggest?

Sorry for all the questions. Some things Ive found 2/3's of the answer for threwout conversations Ive researched but no real set things. Once I get a good idea of where I want to head with all of these things I should have a straight install. Taking off the week of 9/8-9/16 to get all the major labor done so Id like to have it all figured out and here before then.

Thanks guys

This post has been edited by 1bwilson: Aug 31, 2007 - 6:28 PM

[presure2]

Okay, some of you may know me and some of you might know of me threw the "Big 5sfte post". Well in actuallity I never actually got the chance to finnish my boost project. Long story short I ran into alot of issues with bad shops doing terrible work causing huge failures on my car during the prep phase. It caused me to do a total ground up rebuild of the block, CP forged pistons, 3sgte rods, ARP head studs, P&P'd head 98' metal head gasket. After it was all said and done between the ruined parts and rebuild I spent the better part of 18 months and over $5k on my motor alone and lost all interest in my car and the project.

Since then in the past 2-3 years of being mia from this site the car has sat most of that time. Ive driven it a total of about 7k miles. The good news is the build is rock solid and Ive gained motovation to build the celica up once again. Also its now just a toy rather then a daily driver so now theres really nothing in the way of this car getting boost. Ive actually already started putting it back togather. I just need a few clarifications as I am very rusty.

Oil lines and relocation, does anyone have any pictures of how they ran both or either. Im using the same earls fitting Manny used and was planning to have the oil filter somewhere near the windshield washer refill tank. Anyone else go this route, if now what would you recomend? Lines, my origional oil lines are the exact lines Nuke used on his first 5sfte (if anyone remembers Nuke from back on the c.net boards), their old and very ghetto rigged <3 Nuke if he reads this . Id like to get the -3an flange welded on and plan to do so. How long of a line is everyone using and what fittings did you need to use to get the best path around the turbo. Any pictures would be great.

Last but never least, I hear the MSD BTM trick isnt that great of a fix, what are the issues? Any fixes out there that I havent seen yet, or is there just no way around a piggy back? If I have to go piggyback once its running im really not upset as id like to make this build a 1 time shot anyway and get it all right the first try. Any good piggybacks out there with a good wideband O2 sensor? If not any good O2's anyone would suggest?

Sorry for all the questions. Some things Ive found 2/3's of the answer for threwout conversations Ive researched but no real set things. Once I get a good idea of where I want to head with all of these things I should have a straight install. Taking off the week of 9/8-9/16 to get all the major labor done so Id like to have it all figured out and here before then.

Thanks guys

brian, for the feed line, you need to make your buy a premade 3an line, with a 90* end, and a straight end. ~18" long.
the tuner toys fitting for the head, and the 3an steel fitting welded onto the stock oil feed line. give me a couple days, ill put a couple pics of my setup up.
the return line is 100% stock 3sgte (using a 3sgte oil pan.)
for tuning, just the SAFCII will work, somthing like the emanage or emanage ultimate will give you alot more tunability in the midrange and lo throttle sections, which makes for better daily driving, and better gas milage.
there are a bunch of companys that make decently priced widebands out there now, just a matter of what features you want ect.
i believe there was a post about a "wideband shootout" comparing diffrent brands, IIRC the innovative got the highest score.

dont use just any line for the oil lines. trust me, its just asking for trouble.
for the oil filter relocation, use the canton racing oil filter adapter (3/4 16 thread) from www.canton racing.com with 1/2npt to 10an male fittings, and 10an lines. use whatever oil filter holder you want.
if you want to incorperate your oil cooler in the setup, you will need to have the oil relief valve bolt cut back about 1/2-3/4 of an inch, and threaded down the same amount.
ill post a few pics of a install im doing now for shannon and jim here soon.

[1bwilson]

Thanks manny, I know you had some great photo's up in your 5sfte thread but alot of them seem to be dead now. I remember and can picture your oil settup. Just wasnt 100% on the line between the 2 (head and turbo feed) but now Ive got the idea. I am interested in seeing the oil relocation positioning you went with. With the batt removed theres room on either side of the bay behind the headlights however getting past the turbo/downpipe either way is a bugger. Ive got the canton fitting and wow its a great product. Very well made from the looks and feel of it along with insane fast shipping, took like 30 hours from the time I ordered it till I got it on regular shipping.

2 more questions, hehe I know they have all been asked but I just cant seem to get what I want from the search.

The oil reducer for the oil feed, does that just connect to the feedline up at the head?

Downpipe, anyone else have issues installing the DP to the turbo (Turbo already bolted to the head)? Im hitting the left side of the middle of the DP on the AC lines. Thinking I could remove the DP studs off of the turbo and line everything up and put them on after but man thats a waste of time. I havent tried installing the DP on the turbo before because the thing is so damn heavy. Any advice on this would be nice as those AC lines are looking more and more expendable.

[presure2]

Thanks manny, I know you had some great photo's up in your 5sfte thread but alot of them seem to be dead now. I remember and can picture your oil settup. Just wasnt 100% on the line between the 2 (head and turbo feed) but now Ive got the idea. I am interested in seeing the oil relocation positioning you went with. With the batt removed theres room on either side of the bay behind the headlights however getting past the turbo/downpipe either way is a bugger. Ive got the canton fitting and wow its a great product. Very well made from the looks and feel of it along with insane fast shipping, took like 30 hours from the time I ordered it till I got it on regular shipping.

2 more questions, hehe I know they have all been asked but I just cant seem to get what I want from the search.

The oil reducer for the oil feed, does that just connect to the feedline up at the head?

Downpipe, anyone else have issues installing the DP to the turbo (Turbo already bolted to the head)? Im hitting the left side of the middle of the DP on the AC lines. Thinking I could remove the DP studs off of the turbo and line everything up and put them on after but man thats a waste of time. I havent tried installing the DP on the turbo before because the thing is so damn heavy. Any advice on this would be nice as those AC lines are looking more and more expendable.

yup, the reducer goes up near the head.

for the DP, i always install the manifold, turbo, and DP as one peice. its heavier, but easier...lol
i know alot of the pics are gone from my post, my comcast host screwed up my account when i moved, and i lost alot of the pics i had uploaded, ill have to go back and reupload some of those..

[presure2]

brian, heres a few pics i had from my install.

first a couple of the oil feed setup



now, a couple diffrent oil filter relocation setups.
first, this is how i ran mine, i ended up using all straight fittings on the block part of the relocation adapter.

that setup runs over to the drivers side of the car, behind the headlights.
im just finishing up a setup now, which is IMO the best, cleanest, and safest way to do it, if you dont mind losing A/C.
the lines run right over to the passanger side of the car, much shorter route, and ALOT cleaner.

i attached the lines to the frame rail with a couple screw in hold-downs


for a little car porn, this is the IC going in the car:

[1bwilson]

Dude, you rock, your even 1 step ahead of me. Got a part # for that belt you got after tossing the A/C? hehe.

[presure2]

Dude, you rock, your even 1 step ahead of me. Got a part # for that belt you got after tossing the A/C? hehe.

i just picked one up at the local autozone, but i can get the PT# if you need it.

also, if your tossing the AC, keep the pressure switch up by the firewall connected (its attached to one of the hard lines) otherwise your fans will run all the time.

[1bwilson]

Nah, I got it. Ill add it to the list. Building up one hell of a shopping list here

Before I go and order something I really dont need you think the Innovate Motorsports XD-16 wideband o2 + APEXI AFC NEO + BTM should hold down the detonation? Should I add water injection also?

The goal is to run 12-15 psi normally but keeping in mind I want to down your 5sfte dyno number I may push it harder

The only thing I have atm is the BTM . I always wanted to save the electronics for the last moment incase anything new came out that made the current settup worthless or a waste.

[1bwilson]

Okay, so today I dig in my box 'o goodies and get my fuel pump out to install. Its a denso and wasnt a good fit so I just went ahead and ordered a new walbro. Its just to important to try and force fit imo. Thats not really what Im posting about anyway, in the box with the pump were 6 supra TT injectors. Since my existing injectors are outdated anyway (using the 315's that I had onrgionally thought would be fint and was later proven by manny to be to small), why not ask if they would fit. I looked them up and they seem to be a 460cc rating injector. My question is will they run on the 5sfte? Im sure the info is out there and Ill start searching myself after I get some food in me. Just figured Id post some progress and ask the question incase someone knew off the top of their head.

pt# 23250-42010

[presure2]

IIRC arnt they low impedance? and side feed?
you can test the impedance with a multimeter, highs should be ~12-14ohms IIRC

[1bwilson]

I believe their top feed but they may be low imp. I know theres a reason I hadnt used them but I wasnt able to place it.

Low imp, just found them online

http://www.injectorservices.com/FlowDataPix/d2325042010.jpg

[1bwilson]

Blah waiting on small things sucks!

oil feed line isnt welded holding up the turbo going on so I cant get the oil filter relocated properly until Im 100% sure nothings in the way.
Since the turbo isnt on I cant finish the hot side of the IC install. Fuel pump didnt line up so I had to reorder a walbro so my car smells of a nice gas perfume. Got to get 2 DP nuts from toyota, 2 Coolent nuts from toyota, DP>Mid pipe gasket, Midpipe>Exhaust gasket........ so little to do and so much time to waste!

Uhoh.... Someone ordered a WI kit

Should be up and running by tuesday turbo only. Im going to get the car started first and then spend the week adding each "Extra" one by one. I have a feeling if I add it all at once and and try to turn the key something will go wrong and Ill spend the week backtracking. Once thats all done (By friday hopefully) Ill limp it over to a shop with a dyno to have a emanage installed (unless they talk me into something else) and the entire thing tuned on their dyno. After alot of archive reading around here Im going with Manny and using the Emanage+WI settup to avoid detonation.

One thing Im still lacking is gauges. Never got them for my first kit and still havent. If it gets to late Ill just walk into a shop and buy some locally. Anyone have a line on some good quality gauges online? Was going to go with Defi but their very expencive and a bit out of my range considering the celica isnt even a DD anymore.

Shopping list:

Gauges - EGT (Sender also)
AF (might get the AEM wideband which includes a gauge)
Boost
Oil pressure (Not 100% sure Ill get this one Lotek has 3 spots and I think the above 3 would be better)

ECU - Emanage ultimate
Emanage ultimate harness (is there one for the celica?)

Misc - Nuts, gaskets, flanges (Flanges should be accounted for once my next shipment arrives)

Injectors - Have the 315's installed now (I can live on these till I pick up a larger set)

I think thats it, unless anyone can think of anything Im missing.

This post has been edited by 1bwilson: Sep 6, 2007 - 8:17 PM

[presure2]

Blah waiting on small things sucks!

oil feed line isnt welded holding up the turbo going on so I cant get the oil filter relocated properly until Im 100% sure nothings in the way.
Since the turbo isnt on I cant finish the hot side of the IC install. Fuel pump didnt line up so I had to reorder a walbro so my car smells of a nice gas perfume. Got to get 2 DP nuts from toyota, 2 Coolent nuts from toyota, DP>Mid pipe gasket, Midpipe>Exhaust gasket........ so little to do and so much time to waste!

Uhoh.... Someone ordered a WI kit

Should be up and running by tuesday turbo only. Im going to get the car started first and then spend the week adding each "Extra" one by one. I have a feeling if I add it all at once and and try to turn the key something will go wrong and Ill spend the week backtracking. Once thats all done (By friday hopefully) Ill limp it over to a shop with a dyno to have a emanage installed (unless they talk me into something else) and the entire thing tuned on their dyno. After alot of archive reading around here Im going with Manny and using the Emanage+WI settup to avoid detonation.

One thing Im still lacking is gauges. Never got them for my first kit and still havent. If it gets to late Ill just walk into a shop and buy some locally. Anyone have a line on some good quality gauges online? Was going to go with Defi but their very expencive and a bit out of my range considering the celica isnt even a DD anymore.

Shopping list:

Gauges - EGT (Sender also)
AF (might get the AEM wideband which includes a gauge)
Boost
Oil pressure (Not 100% sure Ill get this one Lotek has 3 spots and I think the above 3 would be better)

ECU - Emanage ultimate
Emanage ultimate harness (is there one for the celica?)

Misc - Nuts, gaskets, flanges (Flanges should be accounted for once my next shipment arrives)

Injectors - Have the 315's installed now (I can live on these till I pick up a larger set)

I think thats it, unless anyone can think of anything Im missing.

bryan. DO NOT run your car on those 315s. under boost, i saw as high as 17:1 under boost with them, and that was at stock boost.
true, you may use a bit less fuel if your running a stock ct-26, but, IMO the 315s are a recipe for a blown motor. wait till you can get your hands on a set of either 440cc or 460s ( like the ones im running) and be safe.
if you have a FPR, you could in theory raise base pressure a little, and "possibly"get away with it, but, i just wouldnt want to take the chance.
there is no celica specific harness for the emanage.

[1bwilson]

Oh im sorry manny, I wasnt intending on driving on them at all. When I said I could live with them I was only meaning for start ups and whatnot while I iron everything out. Ill have new injectors installed before I plan on doing any driving about. I went the easy route once and had a bad shop do my head work and that became a year rebuild. I dont plan on taking any easy routes this time around. Although had the shop not F'd up my head I wouldnt have invested in the internals so its not all bad ;-)