in dallas, need help with swap, about to do 4age swap, need help Options

[94stONmotegis]

hey whats up guys, i got a 94 st liftback w/ a blown 7afe. i have made my swap choice, due to availability of funds it looks like my best bet is the 4age 20v silvertop. i know the black top has more power blah blah, but i think i will be ok with the silver. here's my delima, im new to dallas and have no shop to work out of. im pretty mechanically inclined and feel confident in doing this swap myself but i lack a cherry picker. i've spoke to intercrew performance down the road and the end price is around 3,000 which includes motor, install and tune. which to be honest sounds rediculous to me. he says 1200 for engine, 1500 for labor and 300 for harness. here's what im thinking........ hoping to find fellow 6gc buddy to help me out with removal and install. i found a 4age 20v for about 850 with 6 month warrenty and free shipping. so far best deal i've seen. As far as removal of 7afe, are there any snags or tricks to ease this process as well as any problems i might encounter. Now the big ?'s. ....... i've been doing quite a bit of research about the install, i plan on sending my harness to Dr. Tweak once i get the engine, so with that said and no one having to remind me of that, if i cant get the tranny with the engine, how well will my 7a drivetrain work? i know i need to lengthen throttle cable, no problem doing that.

what other problems may i encounter and is there anyone in dallas area whom has a facility that wouldnt mind lending/renting to me to do this. any and all feedback appreciated.

[CelicaST_CALI]

u can re use ur tranny,but i believe everything else needs to be pulled

[94stONmotegis]

lol you believe huh? well i believe in a lot of things too, but i dont just need to believe the axles will work, i NEED to konw lol. im just figuring since the tranny works then the axles will as well.


oh oh oh.... also, will i need to run lines differently, mount a/c or anything differently. any info, detailed as possible, on this swap is welcome and appreciated.


i would really like to do this swap myself, save about 2000 and dump that into parts.

upgrades i plan on installing while engine is out..

header
plugs
wires

possibly cams, most likely HKS or TrD, and gears
new timing belt

and whether they need it or not full gasket kit

what do ya'll think?

[Havok1997GT]

i dont think many people on this Site have done this kind of swap. My advise would be to hunt down one of the guys on here that have and PM him and see if they would be a guide for you while you do this. only problem is i dont know who has done this But i dont think you need to waist time with a post other then asking who has done one and talking with them. just my 2 cents

[94stONmotegis]

well thank you havok, good idea, i've seen a previous post from not to long ago from tweak talking about a few that have so ill revert back to that and send a few messages but i am also looking for someone in the dallas area that has a Picker they might be able to lend/rent to me for a day.

[Havok1997GT]

well thank you havok, good idea, i've seen a previous post from not to long ago from tweak talking about a few that have so ill revert back to that and send a few messages but i am also looking for someone in the dallas area that has a Picker they might be able to lend/rent to me for a day.

that would help a lot, Shame your not in Houston. We got a pretty good crew down here of Celi owners that love to help each other make our cars awsome.

that would be kool as hell if you get it all up and running. it would be something different around the Texas area.


but yah bro. happy hunting

[94stONmotegis]

i could get the car to houston but i would have to be driving it back cause ill probably be towin it behind a uhaul lol. and i concure sir that doin the 4age swap and doing a lil bit of work and seeing what happens will be different. my future plans hopefully this summer is turbo kit. people on here are so wrapped up in the 3sgte, for good reason lol, however the old rwd corolla's were some of the first drift cars ya know? lots of mods available and many turbo applications that are very successful. as for now i believe a good start after install would be cams, gears and tuning will suffice, along with the basics... i.e. intake, exhaust, plugs, wires, etc..

[goferris]

i know of 2 people on the site that have done this swap. coomer and netrata. other than that just do a member search.
gl on your project.

[94stONmotegis]

i sent netrata a message and we'll see what he says. only luck i need is that the engine i order is gonna be ready to rock when i get it. but you never know

i've been planning this for some time now, so within the next few weeks i plan on recieving my engine and getting my celica trasported to my current location and working some magic. any and all tips with removal process, anything i need to look out for please, let me know asap

[JDM_Factory]

why not do a 3vz swap instead of the 4age? I can get a jdm 3vz for $700 shipped or jdm 4age for $750 shipped, save about $100. I'm currently doing a 3vz swap for a mr2. Same concept but easier to work on the celica imo. Just need to fab a mount for the passenger side and use a 5s tranny with the 3 mounts for it. I'm in ft worth btw. Just thought i throw in my opinion.

[94stONmotegis]

i plan on doing all/most work myself so 4age seams like the logical choice. a 3vz sounds like a crazy swap, and the extra work and mis matching a few things i for see problems down the road. if you can get me the 4age 750 shipped with some kind of warrenty that would be right up my alley. if you have yahoo hit me up, nittolegend13 and lets talk

[94stONmotegis]

also, you are doing the 3vz right now into an mr2 what would it take for you to do my 4age ? i would like to do it myself but because of time restraints and lack of engine hoist i dont know. however i have been lookin around and found a few hoist and stands for about 100-200 bucks. i know w/e i save is going to allow me to add more upgrades, plus i like to get my hands dirty under the hood. nothing more satisfying sometimes. but for real, let me know what it would take if you have a shop.


again i just see the 4age working very well for me, the 8000 redline sounds nice :0

This post has been edited by 94stONmotegis: Apr 1, 2008 - 2:34 AM

[JDM_Factory]

I'll hit you up on YIM tonight.

[94stONmotegis]

just something might help me along the way while doing this, should be ready helpful to a few others as well.

http://www.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us/09008...irInfoPages.htm

i thought it was pretty good.

swap will be taking place soon, i plan to take plenty of pics and do as complete of a write up as i can.


still, any tips, hints, warnings let me know

found engine hoist and stand for 125 bucks, probably going to pick them up soon



This post has been edited by 94stONmotegis: Apr 1, 2008 - 3:37 PM

[94stONmotegis]

bump

[netrata]

Hey 94stONmotegis, check your pm. Sorry but I won't be able to give you updates often as I'm not in Hawaii right now. I'm currently at NAB in Coronado, California for our 2 weeks Army National Guard training. So i'll get back to you when I'm back home.

[Kwanza26]

Any 4AGE will drop in. With the 20V motors, you can keep the existing coolant lines and such, but if you want a/c and powersteering, that will require some custom fabrication. You can use either the 7A tranny or the 20V tranny, however the 20V tranny will be the best because it's geared for the motor. The stock ST axles WILL WORK. If I remember correctly, I think Coomer used the AE101 axles, which worked also.

This post has been edited by Kwanza26: Apr 4, 2008 - 12:38 PM

[darthripley]

i hope you have a toyota bgb or a chiltons/haynes at the very least to help along the way with dropping the motor & install.

my husband & i did a 4agze swap into our '89 AW11 MR2 but it was a straightforward plug n play.

i guess i'm trying to say its not that hard, just plan everything out, make sure you have all your maintenance parts ahead of time - gaskets, seals, timing belt, water pump, axles etc. so once you get started on things you aren't sitting around on your hands waiting for parts to come in.

i wish we had the time to help you out but we've got our hands full working on our own 3 cars & trying to landscape the backyard & remodel the house every weekend.

This post has been edited by darthripley: Apr 5, 2008 - 8:17 PM

[Havok1997GT]

where did all you Texas people come from? thats 3 in the last week! you guys need to come down to houston, good community down here.

[94stONmotegis]

ALRIGHT!!!! thanks for all the info everyone. i am getting ready to buy the silvertop as soon as income tax comes in which should be within the next week. i am still shopping, but this is deffinately going to happen, i had a 2001 camaro v6 but recently it really started messing up really bad. i am looking at 1400 in labor alone to get headers and oil pan done, thats insane right???? so my mother suggested i just let it go and get my 6gc goin again and that she will help me out with what i need after i order the engine. my car is currently in my home town at one of my mom's houses, where its been for 2 years. i've located a couple of used cherry pickers w/ stand for around 150 which i can always reuse later or get rid of, and i have some buddies w/ farm shops that would provide me with welders, air tools and what not. as for the ac and power steering i dont believe i will have the right equiptment to make new a/c lines but i can live without that until i find somewhere to make them which shouldnt be tough at all. and the power steering i've already spoke w/ netrata about how to mount the pump and run the lines. shouldnt be much trouble there.

Ohh, if anyone knows a reliable source for a good 4age silver post sites, numbers, w/e, i am looking for one in the 750-850 range shipped, w/out tranny, but complete otherwise.


so as of right now the plan is, order engine w/in 2 weeks, between now and then buy hoist and stand, go ahead and pull 7afe out and get harness. next step will have to be after i get engine. i have already emailed dr. tweak and he's ready for me to send harnesses to him. find paseo throttle cable, and have 4age in before i get harness back. while waiting for harness im going to go ahead and service everything from ground up due to car sitting for a few years and double check then triple check everything to make sure its right. get harness back and see what happens.

this swap is going to happen w/in the next month, hopefully i have enough left over to possibly add some bolt ons such as headers back exhaust, ( any recomendations for muffler and cat? ) plugs and wires, and maybe, just maybe some trd or hks cams. tuning will most likely be done at Intercrew Performance here in garland.

if you think you know something i dont please post, even if you think i might already know go ahead and post.

thank you all for your input and knowledge, and watch out next month if you are gonna be on the streets here in D-town, cause if you blink, you'll miss me

This post has been edited by 94stONmotegis: Apr 7, 2008 - 6:12 PM

[Havok1997GT]

when you get it running, get your ass to Houston so we can see it!

i might be coming up there to stay soon for 2 months for school, so if your not done by then maybe i can swing by a check it out.

This post has been edited by Havok1997GT: Apr 8, 2008 - 5:37 PM

[darthripley]

where did all you Texas people come from? thats 3 in the last week! you guys need to come down to houston, good community down here.

i mostly lurk for 5sfe info - good stuff guys & gals are doing here - a lot of the camry guys are pretty stagnant imho.
my husband & i will have to see about coming down sometime for a meet once we get our alltrac fixed up better, that is if you don't mind having a 5th gen celica at a meet.

94st - contact Jonathan at jhot imports up in Denton to see if he has a silvertop 4age available.
good person to deal with and they have good quality engines at decent prices.
he had a blacktop 4age about a month ago with an auto tranny that was real cheap - i think like $700 or $800, can't totally remember.

[94stONmotegis]

alright everyone, appreciate all the support and information.

heres where i am at right now.

still looking for right engine for right price, looking for 4age silver top, maybe black top if price is right. going to be purchasing around the 15th of this month, i have to wait till at least then due to appt at VA Hospital the 14th to see if my dissability has gotten worse and they will be doing test and what not so i have to wait until i am able to do the work. wont be able to see right for a week after i leave.
i went to aviation electronics school while in the navy and i am now feeling pretty confident i could doin the wiring conversion myself after looking at the 4age and 7afe diagrams, i mean all you have to do is wire the 4age harness up to existing 7afe connectors right? i am looking a 4age w/ or w/out tranny since 7afe will work, plus mine only has 90k miles on it, but i need the engine complete otherwise. i am looking to be in the 700-950 range w/ shipping. maybe 1100 but yeah, all i save goes into upgrades
i possibly will be making the trip to hometown and might start pulling 7afe out of car just to get out of way. even if i have to tear it down to remove withouth a hoist, which i think would be fun so i could see the rod i threw lol. so any tips on removing 7afe hit me up, i posted link in previous post with some pretty good instructions, take a look and let me know


oh and darth, i spoke w/ someone at jhot imports and all they have is black tops which would be fine but they are asking 1200 if i come pick it up, lil to steep in my opinion compared to other prices i've been comparing with shipping. i didnt speak w/ johnathan though so.... we'll see, as i said earlier my purcharse time frame is between now and the 15th-16th of this month, however if i come across the right deal i will go ahead and snag it ya know, so if anyone knows where to get a good jdm silvertop let me know, i've looked everywhere online and so far the best deal i have found is from canada w/ shipping is cheaper than buying and doing a local pick up.

again i love this site, been on here for years, forgot my old log in lol. newayz thanks everyone for your input and support.

all feedback, insight or just shootin the breeze please post.

oh and darthripley, a celica is a celica in my opinion, so whenever we get a texas meet organized i want to see as many cars and faces as possible.

update, i need help locating paseo throttle cable not sure what year but yeah, i need it, i think i finally found the engine, 850 w/ shipping everything but ecu, but found some ecu's on ebay and other place for reasonable prices



Billy B.

This post has been edited by 94stONmotegis: Apr 9, 2008 - 3:46 PM

[darthripley]

unfortunately all they have at jhot right now are blacktop 20V 4age's - i talked with jonathan about some other parts the other day.
but you have to remember that $1200 price is the engine, 6spd tranny, uncut harness, ECU and they will give you all the little bits like ignitors etc etc. plus they will tell you exactly how many KM's are on the motor, not the usual "approx. 50K miles" that other importers love to throw around. their motors are clean & they charge less than Jarco in most cases when i was 4agze shopping. just depends how tight your budget is & all.

just make sure you get a good motor that has an uncut harness & all the necessary parts - you'll spend a good deal of money hunting all those little bits & pieces. just search around & you'll see how bad of a time some people have had just getting all the necessary parts.

there was a Paseo in a junkyard in grand prairie we were at last week - i dunno if the motor was still there or not, but you can call around to the import junk yards & ask if they have it or not.

good luck w/everything!

[94stONmotegis]

thanx for the help darth, i called jhot and spoke to them about a blacktop, honestly 1200 is a lil out of my price range however, it is local so i could review before buying which would be A++ and having everything from motor, tranny, ecu/harness and all sensors and ignitor sounds really good. the gentleman i spoke w/ failed to mention they had the 6 speed. that sounds really tempting, very tempting actually, but i dont know if the 6 speek would work w/ my axles. i guess i need to make the drive up there and talk face to face w/ someone. i mean they set up would be the same using a black top, i would just have to discard half the research i've done lol.


as for where im at right now with everything, i will be making the trip to where the car is this weekend and im going to go ahead and pull the 7afe out, check my axles, tranny flywheel, clutch, and w/e else i might be reusing. but being in college puts a damper on the funds so im waiting for taxes to hit the bank this weekend and will be making purchase next week. depending on how my visit w/ the VA Hospital goes and how long it takes for me to return to normal after exams i will begin the swap, i will be taking video and pics and writing detailed report of everything so others may learn as i have.

once completed gonna have to meet up w/ fellow celica owners in area and show it off and get reviews.

does anyone know if the st axles will work with the 7afe tranny? like i said im no spoiled punk, but once i spend all my money my mom is going to be helping me w/ what i need to get this going since im cruising on foot right now sleeping on mommas couch. lets just say my life has had a bad luck streak here lately. but hey we all hit lows but only so we can appreciate when our ship stack is up again right?

hopefully by the end of this month everything will be complete and ill be burning the roads up again.

again any info. feed back or just chit chat please post and if you have any ?'s put them out there.

[darthripley]

i don't know what 5spd tranny came with the 7afe - is it a C-series tranny or an S-series tranny?

the blacktop 20v's came with C-56 tranny.

this is a good page to read although it has to do with a MKI MR2 there is still lots of info that can help.

http://www.padandwheels.com/mr2/index.html

sorry i can't help more with the 6th gen celica stuff, i know some about ST205's but i learn more everyday.
i'm more knowledgable regarding MKI MR2's & 5th gen celicas specifically ST185's.

can't wait to see it once it's done.
i've seen a silvertop 20v swap once in a guy's MKI MR2 - sounded pretty sweet.