Mrgrapes war with RSX vs celica Options

[mrgrape]

k so i was as u guys know, looking for a car
http://www.dc5nation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11824
self explanitory, they bashed on me like u guys do here
but then we got into a heated debate over RSX vs celica...
i said the torque on our celicas are faster then a RSX-S
but yeah i also might have found my car
ill post pics once i get it

[tomazws]

RSX (Type-S)

200 hp @ 7400 rpm ('02-'04)
210 hp @ 7800 rpm ('05+)

142 lb-ft @ 6000 rpm ('02-'04)
143 lb-ft @ 7000 rpm ('05+)


6GC (GT)

135 hp @ 5400 rpm
145 lb-ft @ 4400 rpm


I'd congrat you if you're able to get a DC5 Type-S. Car's newer, interior's slick, 6 speed manual... show us pictures man


Edit: BTW, Those stats are USDM....

[mrgrape]

lol well i know our hp stock is def slower, but i was just debating torque wise....and i dunno if their right or im right.
only argued bc i was looking at rsx owners what u dont like about ur cars and they all said the torque so i looked it up.

also the rsx-s was my plan, but if u look at that thread ive found an s14 done by a highly sought mechanic who did gumball and all the drift events
and 304 hp at the wheels..with 155k on chassis and 75k on motor.
thanks on the positive note, i dont want to be talking outta my ass like i have been the past few posts
and i wll post up pics once i get it!

[playr158]

Most 6th gens have less TQ and HP than an RSX and will get walked silly by one too.

They do hit peak torque slightly later than a celica but thats because celicas don't rev at all where as the RSX motor does.

[lagos]

wait... you posted at 2:47am that you want an rsx. then at 3:15am you changed your mind and now want an s14, and you wonder why we tease you?

This post has been edited by lagos: Dec 12, 2008 - 8:27 AM

[block]

dude, an rsx type-s will walk all over our 6th gen celicas. now, if you're comparing the 7th gen gt-s vs the rsx type-s then we'd have a good debate cause they're both quick 6 second/15 second 1/4 miles

This post has been edited by block: Dec 12, 2008 - 8:47 AM

[DEATH]

LOL - I raced an RSX-S with my buddy's '01 GTS and let me tell you - it's nasty [At the track of course - I wouldn't race a friend's car any other way]. Race started out fairly even but the RSX must have better [or sooner lift] cause about midway thru 3rd gear the differences started showing.
Now our GT's may have more down-low tQ but I wouldn't pit a USDM GT against a Type-S unless it was Shannon's or Presure's

This post has been edited by DEATH: Dec 12, 2008 - 9:18 AM

[Supersprynt]

Hondas are all top end.

[bccentaur3]

LOL - I raced an RSX-S with my buddy's '01 GTS and let me tell you - it's nasty [At the track of course - I wouldn't race a friend's car any other way]. Race started out fairly even but the RSX must have better [or sooner lift] cause about midway thru 3rd gear the differences started showing.
Now our GT's may have more down-low tQ but I wouldn't pit a USDM GT against a Type-S unless it was Shannon's or Presure's

The difference is that the GTS right before hitting LIFT power dips then picks up when LIFT is achieved. Now for the type-S vtec is smooth and doesn't dip before hitting vtec making.

[Helix]

One "problem" with the vvtl-i is that the "lift" doesn't last as long as the honda vtec. The hondas have higher redline i think...
What would you say if we compare the beams with type-s??

[DEATH]

One "problem" with the vvtl-i is that the "lift" doesn't last as long as the honda vtec. The hondas have higher redline i think...
What would you say if we compare the beams with type-s??

My buddy's GTS has a 8250RPM redline [Depends on the year greatly actually - I think they made two revisions IIRC] - tho it throws a misfire code if you stay above 8K too long [we're talking a second here]. He's on engine #3 over that particular issue - our friend who is a Toyota Tech says he thinks it's improperly sized injectors but IDK.
I'd pit an SS-III [A real one] vs a Type-S anyday - might be a close as hell race but I got my money on Toyota.

[mrgrape]

oh thanks guys i didnt know that... also why wasnt the gt4 imported in america?

[Akirad1]

Cause our country was founded by prudes and anything fun that isnt made in America isnt aloud. But i do love this Country

[DEATH]

Nice one - because the "alltracs" they tried to sell in previous models didn't sell - that's all - no global conspiracy was at work here.

[tomazws]

Also I wonder why they're called "AllTrac" here... Can't they just leave it GT-Four!?!?!??!?

[Kwanza26]

lol well i know our hp stock is def slower, but i was just debating torque wise....and i dunno if their right or im right.
only argued bc i was looking at rsx owners what u dont like about ur cars and they all said the torque so i looked it up.

also the rsx-s was my plan, but if u look at that thread ive found an s14 done by a highly sought mechanic who did gumball and all the drift events
and 304 hp at the wheels..with 155k on chassis and 75k on motor.
thanks on the positive note, i dont want to be talking outta my ass like i have been the past few posts
and i wll post up pics once i get it!

Don't be a retard... Did you just turn 16 and mommy and daddy's gonna buy you a car or something? You should go learn more about how horsepower/torque moves a car before you go around saying who will win against what. If you're curious, I have posted on the topic before... so look it up.

Anyway... if you're from cali... get a LEGAL car. A 300whp S14 is probably not gonna be legal... and you, sounding like a kiddie, will probably drive like one, get pulled over, then BAM... impounded car. The RSX-S is probably one of the fastest sports compact imports you can buy... so... yeah... if you want easy speed, RSX-S. Those K20 motors are quite fantastic.

This post has been edited by Kwanza26: Dec 12, 2008 - 3:14 PM

[DEATH]

Kwanza hasn't graced us with his presense in IDK how long but when he does? - true to Kwanza-form

[95st-celica]

difference bettwen the 2000 gt-s and the 2001-04? gt-s?

[Kwanza26]

LOL - I raced an RSX-S with my buddy's '01 GTS and let me tell you - it's nasty [At the track of course - I wouldn't race a friend's car any other way]. Race started out fairly even but the RSX must have better [or sooner lift] cause about midway thru 3rd gear the differences started showing.
Now our GT's may have more down-low tQ but I wouldn't pit a USDM GT against a Type-S unless it was Shannon's or Presure's

That's because torque doesn't mean much unless you have a ton of it to quickly turn long gears. If you're any less than 8 cylinders and 5 liters and/or not turbo/supercharged... you probably can't quickly turn long gears... therefore you utilize rotational dynamics and run short gears with higher rotation (Horsepower). Even our Celicas do this...

One "problem" with the vvtl-i is that the "lift" doesn't last as long as the honda vtec. The hondas have higher redline i think...
What would you say if we compare the beams with type-s??

My buddy's GTS has a 8250RPM redline [Depends on the year greatly actually - I think they made two revisions IIRC] - tho it throws a misfire code if you stay above 8K too long [we're talking a second here]. He's on engine #3 over that particular issue - our friend who is a Toyota Tech says he thinks it's improperly sized injectors but IDK.
I'd pit an SS-III [A real one] vs a Type-S anyday - might be a close as hell race but I got my money on Toyota.

Plain and simply, the K20 has a far better lift system, is an under-tuned motor from the factory, is a bigger motor, and a squared motor. It makes more torque than the average 2.0 liter, makes significantly more horsepower, and is under-tuned to boot (10 whp from a CAI!!!), not to mention in stock trim, can reliably hold revs over 9000 rpms. There aren't any real negative sides to the K20 as a tuning motor... whereas the 2ZZ does. The 2ZZ, you could argue is also under-tuned... but it's not so much under-tuned as it is poorly tuned to make horsepower during lift. That's why guys with standalone computers and piggybacks can make so much more power. In a head to head comparison however, the difference maker is the displacement. The 2ZZ will always make a bit less torque, therefore a bit less horsepower. Also, the 2ZZ still uses a bucket system, which typically isn't as efficient for high revs. High revs is the only way these guys are gonna make power. That being said, I would pick the K20 over the BEAMS easy. Hell, I'd pick the 2ZZ over the BEAMS because the 2ZZ can still be tuned up, while the BEAMS is a highly tuned motor from the factory. The beams does have a nice shiny red valve cover though...

[Kwanza26]

difference bettwen the 2000 gt-s and the 2001-04? gt-s?

2000 and 2001 are the same ~8200 rpm fuel cut... 2002-2004 (either 03 or 04) has a 7800 rpm fuel cut. 2005 is the same as 2000-2001.

[Tigawoods]

just get a mazdaspeed 3.

[mrgrape]

Plain and simply, the K20 has a far better lift system, is an under-tuned motor from the factory, is a bigger motor, and a squared motor. It makes more torque than the average 2.0 liter, makes significantly more horsepower, and is under-tuned to boot (10 whp from a CAI!!!), not to mention in stock trim, can reliably hold revs over 9000 rpms. There aren't any real negative sides to the K20 as a tuning motor... whereas the 2ZZ does. The 2ZZ, you could argue is also under-tuned... but it's not so much under-tuned as it is poorly tuned to make horsepower during lift. That's why guys with standalone computers and piggybacks can make so much more power. In a head to head comparison however, the difference maker is the displacement. The 2ZZ will always make a bit less torque, therefore a bit less horsepower. Also, the 2ZZ still uses a bucket system, which typically isn't as efficient for high revs. High revs is the only way these guys are gonna make power. That being said, I would pick the K20 over the BEAMS easy. Hell, I'd pick the 2ZZ over the BEAMS because the 2ZZ can still be tuned up, while the BEAMS is a highly tuned motor from the factory. The beams does have a nice shiny red valve cover though...

damn i didnt know that...i feel like a dummy now...10whp just from a CAI!! damnn!
im still leaning towards the s14 right now, but if that doesnt work im def getting an RSX-S!
thanks man

[bccentaur3]

is this s14 powered by the sr20 or the KA24?

[xredjokerx]

or an RB20 or RB25!

This post has been edited by xredjokerx: Dec 13, 2008 - 2:59 PM

[RickJamesBish]

S14 has an RB20 IIRC.

[Akirad1]

actually it came with a KA24DE I4
RB20 came in R31 and 32 skylines

This post has been edited by Akirad1: Dec 13, 2008 - 5:24 PM

[dustin15brown]

just get a Ferrari F430

[nakamura]

Euro and JDM s14 has an SR20 DE(t). 200ps euro and 220 JDM.
The US got that shocking 2.4 thing which goes about as fast as a golf cart!

[bccentaur3]

When I asked him that question I was asking if the car was swapped or not. I know that the US spec s14 came with the KA24 and the JDM silvia came with the sr20

[97celiman]

mrgrape...your threads make me giggle almost as much as gt4 soldier...i cannot believe parents would buy some kid a fairly new performance model of a car...as kwanza said you prob drive like a kid...parents who give kids cars like that are just asking for trouble...

[Akirad1]

mrgrapes why not just post when you actually got the car instead of the debate of getting one or the other cause you change your mind more than a woman changes clothes.

[97celiman]

mrgrapes why not just post when you actually got the car instead of the debate of getting one or the other cause you change your mind more than a woman changes clothes.

what he said x a kajillion

[mrgrape]

is this s14 powered by the sr20 or the KA24?

sr20, the cars got a kouki conversion pwp,
done by len higa- lead mechanic for gumball 3000 as well as r and d director of apexi and team member of 02 motorworks so i trust his work.
next post will be with my car....keep u guys updated!

[lagos]

If your going with nissan, why not just get a new GTR?

[mrgrape]

If your going with nissan, why not just get a new GTR?

uhhhh way beyond what i can afford

[95CelicaST]

If your going with nissan, why not just get a new GTR?

uhhhh way beyond what i can afford

you said your next post would be with your car..... then you posted again.... without a car. You're a liar mrgrape. You poop mouth.

[playr158]

can we just lock this BS up?

of all the stupid threads that get locked on this site, why isnt' this?

[Rayme]

just get a Ferrari F430

word

[Akirad1]

nah he should deff get an Enzo or a R8

[RickJamesBish]

He wouldn't be worth an R8...now, plenty of stupid people have smashed up Enzo's, so that could be doable.

[nakamura]

When I asked him that question I was asking if the car was swapped or not. I know that the US spec s14 came with the KA24 and the JDM silvia came with the sr20

Oops. Begging your pardon mate!