Hey guys! new to the forum, but not to the car, Found the after market finally for my Celica GT! Options

[UndecidedPC9397]

so as it says, I found this forum almost by mistake but found a thread with a black Celica that had been turbo'd and im back in the Celica groove. Im not thinking of really boosting the car... yet but I do what better exhaust and intake. im gonna attempt to go with that 90-93 accord CAI kit idea and get custom exhaust.
First thing I wanted to know is whos tuning Celicas in minnesota, cuz I would love to meet you guys. and also with my exhaust, I still need to find a fab shop to do my exhaust but I was think of doing a full custom exhaust (header to muffler) and wanted to know how much that might run and if anyone has done it with there 5S-FE? I have alot more things Id like to figure out (getting JDM tails, suspension, rims, etc.) but I wanna get this figured and get some rough numbers before anything else, because I hate that butt ugly stock exhaust manifold. Thank you

[mkernz22]

only header we have is an ebay header or the JDM Jasma (i believe that's the name). Other than that, you'd have to get one custom fabbed. I had my exhaust put on by a place called Lou's Custom Exhaust. They took everything off, put my header and flex section on, and custom fabbed from the cat back (but i have no cat) and it was about $550 with a flowmaster 40 series and a tip on it. Sounds very low toned for a 4 banger haha

[RabidTRD]

Any header for a 3S-GE or 5S-FE will fit. You may have to custom fab a down pipe, but you are planning that anyway. Tannabe made the Medalion G-Power headers for a while and they're rare, but you can find eBay remakes for decently cheap. JASMA isn't a brand, it's the "Japanese Automotive Sport Muffler Association." Anything that's JASMA certified is worth money and good.

[Smaay]

thank you for saying HEADER!!!!!! you can get the Ebay header and then have a fab shop build you a custom exhaust all the way back. but if you are not boosting then just get the header and have an axle back installed. you dont need anything larger.

[mkernz22]

thank you for saying HEADER!!!!!!

you're welcome? lol
i always call it a header

[stephen_lee]

thank you for saying HEADER!!!!!!

you're welcome? lol
i always call it a header

lots of people say headerS here even though its only one... since we only have one head... well most of us

[RabidTRD]

I have two lol

This post has been edited by RabidTRD: Dec 19, 2011 - 1:52 PM

[stephen_lee]

well....idk how exactly to take that. lol you have two heads,,,, in your engine bay.. or... two heads total, but not in the same bay.. or... anatomically

but i def have two heads in my engine bay

[RabidTRD]

Giggity.

:X

[UndecidedPC9397]

Thank you guys so much for the responces! I didnt know people would respond to this so quick, took me by surprise! So just to clear things up:

Any header for a 3S-GE or 5S-FE will fit. You may have to custom fab a down pipe, but you are planning that anyway. Tannabe made the Medalion G-Power headers for a while and they're rare, but you can find eBay remakes for decently cheap. JASMA isn't a brand, it's the "Japanese Automotive Sport Muffler Association." Anything that's JASMA certified is worth money and good.

I ran through this idea too, but someone on another forum said it doesnt help much performance wise, as he said: 'Youre replacing a stock header with a stock header'.
And since our oil filters for the 2.2's are right up front, would it hinder the ability to get at the filter? and where do you find JASMA certified goodies? do they have a site you can look thru?

thank you for saying HEADER!!!!!!

you're welcome? lol
i always call it a header

lots of people say headerS here even though its only one... since we only have one head... well most of us

Hey, if you really wanted to, you probably could get 2 and have dual exhaust. That would be a pretty interesting idea. And talking about headers just went some crazy direction Ive never seen

well....idk how exactly to take that. lol you have two heads,,,, in your engine bay.. or... two heads total, but not in the same bay.. or... anatomically

but i def have two heads in my engine bay

like I said, s*** just flew out the window.

And this is something else ive wondered for a while. Why is the aftermarket so hard to find for these cars? it took me about a year to find this forum, but it has eveything! and it got me so stoked for my build.

This post has been edited by UndecidedPC9397: Dec 19, 2011 - 6:19 PM

[RabidTRD]

Here are some images of one:




This is the one I bought. This one will actually do something, unlike the ebay ones that are the exact same as the OEM ones, just minus the cat and stainless steel.

There are some others that go 4-2-1 that are even better... but they're hard to find. They allow for the filter to be removed still as you can see in the first pic.

These would be a fun pick up, but I'm not sure they'll fit:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/250872112772?ssPag...#ht_2594wt_1396

It will bolt to the block, but I don't know if it'll clear the alt, and if you've got room to get the oil filter out.

This post has been edited by RabidTRD: Dec 19, 2011 - 7:21 PM

[UndecidedPC9397]

Here are some images of one:




This is the one I bought. This one will actually do something, unlike the ebay ones that are the exact same as the OEM ones, just minus the cat and stainless steel.

There are some others that go 4-2-1 that are even better... but they're hard to find. They allow for the filter to be removed still as you can see in the first pic.

These would be a fun pick up, but I'm not sure they'll fit:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/250872112772?ssPag...#ht_2594wt_1396

It will bolt to the block, but I don't know if it'll clear the alt, and if you've got room to get the oil filter out.

Is that header off of a camry? it sure as hell looks like one

[Ted95]

a camry and a celica GT has the same motor only different tranny setups. they both come with a 5sfe engine which is why it looks so similar.

[UndecidedPC9397]

a camry and a celica GT has the same motor only different tranny setups. they both come with a 5sfe engine which is why it looks so similar.

So does it allow exhaust to flow better and increase perofrmance or is the manifold the exact same thing as the one I have now?

[richee3]

The header will flow better. I've heard mixed opinions on them. Some people say they make a difference on the butt dyno, others say they just make a better noise. At any rate, it can't flow much worse than the OEM exhaust manifold.

[UndecidedPC9397]

The header will flow better. I've heard mixed opinions on them. Some people say they make a difference on the butt dyno, others say they just make a better noise. At any rate, it can't flow much worse than the OEM exhaust manifold.

So what aftermarket hearders do you recommend? I saw KOSpeed header for a decent amout of money but I dont know whick brands to steer clear of except pacesetters. and what kind of difference do they make? 5-10HP or would it be less since its just a header?

This post has been edited by UndecidedPC9397: Dec 20, 2011 - 6:38 PM

[mkernz22]

The header will flow better. I've heard mixed opinions on them. Some people say they make a difference on the butt dyno, others say they just make a better noise. At any rate, it can't flow much worse than the OEM exhaust manifold.

So what aftermarket hearders do you recommend? I saw KOSpeed header for a decent amout of money but I dont know whick brands to steer clear of except pacesetters. and what kind of difference do they make? 5-10HP or would it be less since its just a header?

it's a *header. just one. and you can just get an ebay brand, slap it on, and call it a day. you might get 5-10hp, not sure. I dyno'd my car and it was 107hp and 123ft-lbs, and that's after 229k bahaha

[UndecidedPC9397]

The header will flow better. I've heard mixed opinions on them. Some people say they make a difference on the butt dyno, others say they just make a better noise. At any rate, it can't flow much worse than the OEM exhaust manifold.

So what aftermarket hearders do you recommend? I saw KOSpeed header for a decent amout of money but I dont know whick brands to steer clear of except pacesetters. and what kind of difference do they make? 5-10HP or would it be less since its just a header?

it's a *header. just one. and you can just get an ebay brand, slap it on, and call it a day. you might get 5-10hp, not sure. I dyno'd my car and it was 107hp and 123ft-lbs, and that's after 229k bahaha

Yeah i know, im referring to more than one, since theres more than one header on the market. sorry for any confusion, im not THAT much of a noob lol and do you have ST model? cuz if I read correctly, GT's come stock with 135hp

[mkernz22]

that's to the wheels haha not the crank

[Ted95]

theres usually about a 15-20ish hp difference between hp from the crank to the wheels.

This post has been edited by Ted95: Dec 20, 2011 - 11:29 PM

[UndecidedPC9397]

Oh yeah, forgot that fact of life for a second lol

[mandrek]

well fact is (just as it has already been stated) most anything will flowbetter than stock.. though as the where the power gains will come on, and how much, is definatly up in the air... imo the best thing you could do (assuming that you have access to a welder) would be to just get an ebay knock off, (assuming that at least the fit is right)....reinforce all the joints and seams on the out side AND inside. then use a carbide burr, and make sure that all of the merging points on the unit are nice and smooth.. you would be amazed at just how much power you can make by just making sure that the seams (on the inside) and collectors are smooth and open!!! (Booste2.0 started his buisness doing that exact thing, on stock 2zz headers!!! and gave dyno proven numbers!!!) will all of your work pay off in BIG numbers? nope, most likly not. but you will get the most out of what you are paying for? YES!!!! Buy a knock off, raw product, then massage it!!! i would also finnish it off with some nice hight temp ceramic paint (prime first) and heat wrap.. evey little but helps..

and i should not have to say this, but the ECU alone will not be able to comensate and max the performance out of the new parts, for that you will need, at least a good piggback.

it used to be that people would think about getting a piggy back/ stand alone only after you have gotten a few big mods, but IMO with how little the cost now (with respect to how much they Used to cost, like 10 years ago) they should be one of the FIRST mods to do on ANY car.. the amount of "free" power that can be made on a stock setup (as in ECU tuneing only) is quite supriseing! and it will give you the ability to maximise the potential of every performance mod you do from there on out!!!!

just my $0.02..


(oh and btw i have a set of the ebay knock offs for my 5sfe mr2, and definatly can tell.. a bit more torquey. i have not gotten to do the suggested mods to the header since at the time i was trying to "just get the car on the road"... but i will be doing the same thing so my 7a celica, and will post results when done (a few months perhaps)

good luck!!!!

[UndecidedPC9397]

Wo thank you, I dont have access to a welder but I can take care of burrs for the most part, is it mainly around the flanges or is there some more in the header, like the around the o2 sensors and what not?

[mandrek]

Wo thank you, I dont have access to a welder but I can take care of burrs for the most part, is it mainly around the flanges or is there some more in the header, like the around the o2 sensors and what not?

yeah for the most part it is @ the flanges (all of em) and all the merges. what i noticed on the 3 diffrent ones that i have, is that it looks like the pipes are manufactured in such a rushed fashon thatrough cuts and slight bends are not addresed at all, and that for the most part if you look down any connection between 2 pipes, you will see an abundance of excess matirial. sometimes flaring inwared, right in the wrong direction.

the reason for the welding on the inside is two fold. one: to reinforce the seams from the inside since the header is assembled and welded from the out side.. and alot of times it seems like the welds do not have a very good amout of penitration. and two: to get rid of alot of thes really nasty steps and juts that happen on the inside.. in some header design a "step" is a good thing, but it is measured and precise. not the case with these headers. it is a manufactoring sloppyness that is causing these steps.. futher more the welding on the inside to get rid of these steps and juts, is mainly to give you matirial to then properly cut down, smooth, with a carbide burr..

This post has been edited by mandrek: Dec 22, 2011 - 12:11 AM

[UndecidedPC9397]

Reviving this thread to try to get some answers.

Im gonna be running a non boosted 5SFE and see how much NA power I can get. Mainly, im starting with exhaust and intake. with exhaust, it sounds like you should run 2.25 - 2.5. I would like the low end kick but also want good power gain inthe high range as well. which (between the 2.25 and 2.5) is better for something like that? if neither, is there a happy medium between them like 2.38? (yes thats the rounded median, you can call me a nerd lol) and also I want a exhaust note with low rumble and sounds really mean when you hit the gas. My sister's boyfriend has a Contour SVT that has dual magnaflow canisters that sound sinster as hell (not the best example since contours of any kind are not the first things that come to mind when you think of 'sexy sports car' but thats all the exposure in my family that I have to tuning) but what are good mufflers and resonators for that kind of sound and performance? thanks for any responces about this!

[mandrek]

no reviving needed.. lol...

just read

[UndecidedPC9397]

I did read this forum but thanks for not ignoring this thread, I thought by now it would be dead lol but I read alot more thorough then before. I think I found My desired piping diameter and muffler (EVO2 style muffler, 2.5" piping) And thinking of a magnaflow resonator and highflow cat but do you know any others that would be better? and what header (ebay or any other) works best? or should I get the fab shop (when I find one) to make one? those are the only points im not sure of yet.

[mandrek]

well, my forum friend.. interesting that you are looking at those choices.. i have been doing some research my self, and the exhaust that i will be going with for many reasons is a 2.5" header back, 304 SS. i too like the EvoII can, i fell in love with it when my brother had an Evo II exhaust for his 2000GTS (GReddy). unfortunately the unit is no longer available from greddy. but you can get one off Ebay from OBX (who looks like they picked up the design after greddy dropped it)..

the only issue that i take with the EVOII can is that large 4" tip on it..

For resonators i will be going with 2x of aeroturbine's AR25 resonators. (inline one after another in the mid pipe). i chose to go with a pair of this unit after reading a large number of reviews on a wide array of different platforms.(just Google "review aeroturbine AR25" and you will see what i mean) along with before and after sound clips..

now.. just to note that i have chosen to go this route on my exhaust setup because i will be going turbo on my lil 7AFE, and there is no way that i will max out a 2.5" exhaust.. the aeroturbine resonators are !true! 2.5" strait through designs. meaning if you measured the pipe that goes down the the inside of the it too is still 2.5" so there is little to no restriction from the resonators. this is not true of many of the other resonators on the market. the 304 SS has a great properties, lighter that mild/aluminized steal, great heat management, and an ok cost. (for SS)

also i will not be going with a cat, i may later, but my car has no need to ever be registered or inspected ever again.. (unless my parents move states) should i ever need to though, i will get a SS cased ceramic cored cat. they take a bit longer to light up, but they last allot longer than metal cored cats, especially when using E85. (i may have that backwards on the metal vs ceramic. but either way i will take the one that last longer, over the one that lights up quicker)

i will be doing a coat of ceramic black paint all along the exhaust, all the way up to the tip. aswell as Ti exhaust wrap. this will do the best to contain temps inside the exhaust (and thus reducing the temp drops and maintaining exhaust velocity) aswell as protecting the unit from foren elements. not to mention it will also not draw too much attention to the under side of the car from the rear (as in if a cop was pacing me)

to minimize the bends and provide maximum performance i will go with an under-axle set-up.. many celis are using this type of routing on a DD, and report next to no issues with it.

[UndecidedPC9397]

well, my forum friend.. interesting that you are looking at those choices.. i have been doing some research my self, and the exhaust that i will be going with for many reasons is a 2.5" header back, 304 SS. i too like the EvoII can, i fell in love with it when my brother had an Evo II exhaust for his 2000GTS (GReddy). unfortunately the unit is no longer available from greddy. but you can get one off Ebay from OBX (who looks like they picked up the design after greddy dropped it)..

the only issue that i take with the EVOII can is that large 4" tip on it..

For resonators i will be going with 2x of aeroturbine's AR25 resonators. (inline one after another in the mid pipe). i chose to go with a pair of this unit after reading a large number of reviews on a wide array of different platforms.(just Google "review aeroturbine AR25" and you will see what i mean) along with before and after sound clips..

now.. just to note that i have chosen to go this route on my exhaust setup because i will be going turbo on my lil 7AFE, and there is no way that i will max out a 2.5" exhaust.. the aeroturbine resonators are !true! 2.5" strait through designs. meaning if you measured the pipe that goes down the the inside of the it too is still 2.5" so there is little to no restriction from the resonators. this is not true of many of the other resonators on the market. the 304 SS has a great properties, lighter that mild/aluminized steal, great heat management, and an ok cost. (for SS)

also i will not be going with a cat, i may later, but my car has no need to ever be registered or inspected ever again.. (unless my parents move states) should i ever need to though, i will get a SS cased ceramic cored cat. they take a bit longer to light up, but they last allot longer than metal cored cats, especially when using E85. (i may have that backwards on the metal vs ceramic. but either way i will take the one that last longer, over the one that lights up quicker)

i will be doing a coat of ceramic black paint all along the exhaust, all the way up to the tip. aswell as Ti exhaust wrap. this will do the best to contain temps inside the exhaust (and thus reducing the temp drops and maintaining exhaust velocity) aswell as protecting the unit from foren elements. not to mention it will also not draw too much attention to the under side of the car from the rear (as in if a cop was pacing me)

to minimize the bends and provide maximum performance i will go with an under-axle set-up.. many celis are using this type of routing on a DD, and report next to no issues with it.

Yeah I want to do header back, But I want something better than my stock header which looks like crap to boot, should I get a camry 5sfe header or an ebay header? and why that grade of stainless steel? and if you go to a exhaust shop, is that an option you can request? And I live in minnesota where I know they dont do emission but I want to play it safe for right now. And are you gonna wrap the header or paint everything? and are you also painting the muffler?? and do the magnaflows have ceramic cores? and I do agree that tip is a bit bulbous but the main thing is it does the job, everybody has said good things about them. And your running two on a 7afe, what do you think would be better for my GT with a 5sfe? just go with one or should I aim for two? I really want to try to get the most power off NA that I can to challenge myself a bit and see what this engines potential is w/out a turbo but have it be tastefully done and sound really nice. And I know this is a bit of a noob question but do I need a flexpipe or can I ditch it? Im still very new to the car and tuner scene so im still trying to learn the basics.

This post has been edited by UndecidedPC9397: Dec 26, 2011 - 12:46 AM

[mandrek]

Yeah I want to do header back, But I want something better than my stock header which looks like crap to boot, should I get a camry 5sfe header or an ebay header?
** they are one and the same.. just get an ebay header for the 5sfe. you will have to fab up a small section to match to the stock piping if you are just doing the header alone..if you are going to do it all at once then dont wory about it and just have the exhaust start at the end of the header.

and why that grade of stainless steel?
**last time i was looking at SS cost it was one of the cheapest, that may have changed now, but also alot of the parts (like the resonator) are made out of 304.

and if you go to a exhaust shop, is that an option you can request?
**most likely not. most exhaust shops only use mild/aluminised steal. and they use a crush bender to bend the pipes. you will probably have to find a "pro-shop" or some one who has a tig and knows how to use it.

And I live in minnesota where I know they dont do emission but I want to play it safe for right now.
** that is a good point, but if you have to cut on cost, u know where to do it now.. just leave some extra room behind the first flange so that you could always put a cat in later.

And are you gonna wrap the header or paint everything?
**for me i will do it in three steps. step 1: (since the cost of having it properly powder coated is quite high) i will be painting the whole thing w/ a hight temp ceramic black. Step 2: then wrap it with Ti type exhaust wrap. The fibers are made from crushed volcanic rock, and unlike regular fiberglass based exhaust wrap, do not need to be soaked in water to make em wrap tighter, and farther more will not slack when they get wet from rain/melted snow. AND the Ti wrap is supposed to offer better heat management. Step 3:a final coat of silicon based exhaust wrap paint (black) this will help "seal" the wrap from foren elements, and provide one more heat managing element to the exhaust.

Then and are you also painting the muffler??
** i will be painting mine from the header flange on the head, all the way back (up to) the tip. so if you look at my exhaust b4 install it will be all black but the tip (no jokes here) the tip i will keep polised. as for the exhaust wrap. that will go from the flange on the head, all the way back to the base of the muffler. alot of people only wrap up to the cat, or the axle, but i do not see the point on having any exhaust wrap at all unless you are going to manage the heat as far back as posible and due to the bulbus shape of the EVOII can, it will be too much of a hassle to try to keep the wrap on the can, so ill just stop a the base.

and do the magnaflows have ceramic cores?
** assuming that you are talking about the cat here, i'm sure that they do, i am not posative, but dont see why they would offer one without the other and an option.

and I do agree that tip is a bit bulbous but the main thing is it does the job, everybody has said good things about them.
** yes IMO one of the best sounding mufflers for a 4 banger!!!

And your running two on a 7afe,
** i will running two aeroturbine AR25 resonators in line, and an EVOII muffler at the end.

what do you think would be better for my GT with a 5sfe?just go with one or should I aim for two?
** that is purely up to you. depends on the sound that you are looking for.

I really want to try to get the most power off NA that I can to challenge myself a bit and see what this engines potential is w/out a turbo but have it be tastefully done and sound really nice.
**normaly what will sound nice will not always give the best performance. most of the concepts of sound deadining in and exhaust is based on the interuption or redirection of air flow. any time that you are changing the direction of air flow air will loose momentum and velocity, thus lose in power.. there is alot more to it, but that is a simple jist of it.

And I know this is a bit of a noob question but do I need a flexpipe or can I ditch it?
**KEEP it that one little piece can keep your exhaust from developing any number of leaks and cracks.

Im still very new to the car and tuner scene so im still trying to learn the basics.
** thats ok, just read, then read some more, then read even more!!! thats about all i do.. that wah when i have the money to spend on the car i feel much more confident in my abilities to do it with out screwing up compleatly on the first time around.

[UndecidedPC9397]

Thank you so much for answering all those questions, I truely appreciate it and cant wait to get the exhaust and intake even more! this info really helped alot and im gonna refer back to this when I can through the research. Now I just need to figure out when the best time will be to drop off my car and where. But again, thank you so much for all the help, Really appreciate it!!

[mandrek]

Thank you so much for answering all those questions, I truely appreciate it and cant wait to get the exhaust and intake even more! this info really helped alot and im gonna refer back to this when I can through the research. Now I just need to figure out when the best time will be to drop off my car and where. But again, thank you so much for all the help, Really appreciate it!!

you are quite welcome.

[Smaay]

you are reinventing the wheel, get the ebay header and call it a day

[KAOS]

you are reinventing the wheel, get the ebay header and call it a day

^^ This ^^

You're not going to see any significant gains in the 5S without going turbo... even if you wanted to keep it NA - there'll be more work and cost involved than just swapping out a 3SGTE.

Dreams are good, but a lot of the time they're just that... dreams.

[UndecidedPC9397]

you are reinventing the wheel, get the ebay header and call it a day

^^ This ^^

You're not going to see any significant gains in the 5S without going turbo... even if you wanted to keep it NA - there'll be more work and cost involved than just swapping out a 3SGTE.

Dreams are good, but a lot of the time they're just that... dreams.

But the fact this is my only means of transport, I cant afford to have my car of the road again. I dont doubt that those could be a better option, but I just have no way of doing it, and I'd like to see what this engine can do, ive heard of people getting these to 180HP. Im trying to break away from what the norm has become which is engine swaps because I just dont have more than this car to drive around. If I did I would find a way to get it done. someone pm'd me talking about how they are only of the only people in minnesota that has done this swap and they would guide me thru it, I have none of the equipment to do this, I have the time, and if I sold this car I would have the money, but I would lose the money on the head gasket repair. im at a loss in that and the other cars ive looked into just havent hooked me like the 6th gen celica did.