conversion help..., need parts!!! Options

[pimpstarr690]

Im looking for all the needed materials to do the AWD conversion. I know that people will say that it can't be done but I really dont care what they say! So if anyone know's where i can get a rear axle, drive shaft, and rear suspension please let me know...I wanna start this project ASAP!

[Kwanza26]

Well... based on your wording... you're already in over your head...

here is a general parts list:
ST165/185 rear diff (or custom wedge a different IRS diff), suspension parts, possibly rear spindles, backing plates, rotors and calipers. Rear sub-frames and rear drive axles. E154 AWD transaxle, driveshaft, possibly shift linkages, front inner axle shafts (from V6 5 speed camry, MR2 turbo, or Celica alltrac turbo)...
AWD or RWD fuel tank or aftermarket fuel cell.

A good welder, a very good fabricator, and a very good mechanic.

Now here's my beef... since you don't seem to know what's needed... and since no one here has yet to complete an AWD conversion, where's the logic in basically calling everyone else "dumb" in thinking it's not easy to do, and then going ahead and asking these very people for a list of parts?

A project like this is best done with trial and error. If you're looking for a list of parts that "bolt on" and go... it's not gonna happen. You can essentially use any independent rear drivetrain and "make" it work. I gave you a list... but it's very very general.

This post has been edited by Kwanza26: Dec 4, 2004 - 8:01 PM

[pimpstarr690]

Ok, first I wasn't implying that everyone here is dumb, and i know that this isn't gonna be just a bolt on and go project. I've looked into this before but then didn't go through with the plans. This time is a for sure deal and nothing can't be done. It can, just need to take ALOT of time and be very precise. I'm just in the hunt for some parts. That's all that I asked about...but thanks for the "general" list.

[MaskedMan]

I dont understand... when did he call everyone else "dumb". He just asked for the parts he needed. Maybe he is some really rich person that has a unlimited money and he wants to know what he needs becuase he wants to add onto a celica that he already has or something. Or maybe its like he has to do it or the world blows up or something. Its sounds important. Heres my beef... idk, I dont really have any, I just wanted to say that. Anyways. Thats a nice list of parts there, but um if you had all those parts then it would be possible right? Then whats the problem? Just break stuff down and rebuild. Kinda like legos!!! Omg! Thats awsome! But there would be more cutting and welding and moving of things! It sounds like fun. Good luck and everything will go good. It will be like monster garage!!! I think anything is possible if you put your mind to it. So go forth pimpstarr690 and make me proud!

[Kwanza26]

I apologize about the "dumb" issue... but that was just the impression I got. You can't ask for help and at the same time undermind people's opinions on the topic. It's no biggie though. Good luck... prove us all wrong... ;]

[Bigmeanbulldog55]

Could you maybe get an AWD 5th generation Celica and transplant the parts in? I know the two cars are very similar. I also know that it is possible to do an AWD conversion, at least on some other cars. There was a guy would converted a Geo Storm to AWD using an Isuzu Impulse drive train. I just don't think anyone has had the money or if not that, then the guts to try this switch. Shoot, I'm way to poor to even be thinking about it.

[pimpstarr690]

I understand the conversion is gonna be a BIG step but it WILL be done! Just wait. Im still on the hunt for the parts. Hopefully someone will know where I can find one but Im still gonna keep looking.

[FallenHero]

why do you want to do the swap? Are you going to rally race the car? build it for 3-400whp? if not, just do a 3s swap. you will save enough money (by not doing the AWD conversion) to properly set the engine up and make pretty good power.

[thedevilmaycrie]

even though im with the general majority here i say go for it... if you can find a complete subframe for a alltrac celica(st165/85) then you stand a good chance of doing this... however this is alot easier said then done... the part #'s on the frames are the same for the st165/85/202/204/205... so theres a lil helpful info for yeah... but yeah if you can get a COMPLETE subframe then you can do this .... and it has been done before... a contact i have in florida has dont this and done it right.... one thing to make sure of is, make sure the drivetrain is from the same care dont use a st165 rear end and a st185 tranny.... but good luck to you and make sure you document all work done for future reference...

-DMC

[Kwanza26]

one thing to make sure of is, make sure the drivetrain is from the same care dont use a st165 rear end and a st185 tranny....  but good luck to you and make sure you document all work done for future reference...
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Wouldn't really matter actually. You can use the Alltrac AWD tranny and run it to a Supra rear... so long as the driveshaft fits. I highly highly doubt the ST165 or ST185 shafts will fit however... but the key thing is to design it correctly. The trunk pans are very different between the ST205 and the ST202/204 so regardless, there will be a fair amount of cutting and pasting needed to be done. IMO, it would probably be of similar difficulty swapping in an actual Celica rear-end vs. a different MacPhearson IRS set-up. Whatever works...

[pimpstarr690]

I am swapping to the 3SGTE within this month or early next. Once that and along with some other goodies =) Im gonna start the AWD conversion. For the Supra rear axle...which gen are we talking about here. Does anyone out here know where I could contact someone to find these parts? lagos had one but Im not sure if he still has it or what. Because I talked to him awhile back about purchasing it but we just never went through with it.

__________
96 Celica Convertable

[playr158]

yo if you want then contact one of our european members and have them look into a junkyard for that stuff......or if you want the supra stuff (which i personally think would be to long) find out year and stuff...get into a junk yard in the states and start pokin around...

you have people here from all over the world use them to your advantage if you have the money

[Mr_E]

Lots of luck. The back end of a 205 is very different indeed.

Ian Smith is breaking a ST205 in the UK.

Mail him;
Enquires@toyautocentre.co.uk

[pimpstarr690]

To answer FallenHero's question...I'm doing the engine swap along with some other things to that. Im doing the AWD conversion because nobody has really done it before and on top of that to a convertable. Im still gonna be adding performance parts when I do the 3s swap so really It's not a big deal. Also we are planning to set up for drift/race. When the project starts I'll keep you all posted with picture's and information.
Another thing...The other day I bought the HAYNES manual and it has nothing on the 6th gen. Is there any other manuals that I cant purchase that will cover the 6th gen?

[thedevilmaycrie]

chiltons... its the only one besides straight from toyota...

-DMC

[pimpstarr690]

How much is it typically for a Chilton's?

[thedevilmaycrie]

20 bones usually

-DMC

[DamDirtyApes]

hasent this been covered like 50 times and is under the search option.......

[celicaspeed]

The toyota book is what you are going to need.I have three different one for my swap.

[pimpstarr690]

Sweet I'll have to go pick one of them up this weekend.

[playr158]

yea dude when you start(from engine swap to finish the whole conversion) TAKE PICTURES OF EVERYTHING and WRITE DOWN how you did it

[pimpstarr690]

No worries...when I start the conversion I'll be taking ALOT of pictures. Im gonna put together a portfoilio for a future refrence. I'll let you know when the conversion starts....

__________
96 Celica Convertable

[SlowCelica94]

For drift? Oh jesus......just got buy an s13 and save the celica from being associated with that horrible fad

[playr158]

WTF are you talking about a terrible FAD.....ummm
its defenitly a MOTOR SPORT here to stay, you can't say
that drift is rice and requires nothing
its probably one of the most challeging forms of racing....
besides rally and maybe 1 other....

s13? ummmm try s15 more ideal for drift

[pimpstarr690]

See that's the thing...you dont see any Celica's competing for Drift. So that's why I wanna set the car up for Drift. That'll be the day to see a vert celica drifting...lol gotta love it.

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96 Celica Convertable

[playr158]

dude we have the same asperations....i wanna drift my hatch

[Kwanza26]

WTF are you talking about a terrible FAD.....ummm
its defenitly a MOTOR SPORT here to stay, you can't say
that drift is rice and requires nothing
its probably one of the most challeging forms of racing....
besides rally and maybe 1 other....

s13? ummmm try s15 more ideal for drift
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It's challenging... yes... but it's a fad when people who can't/shouldn't do it... try to do it. All ends up with a messy spill. Drift drivers are the most highly trained drivers and not just "anybody" can do it. That's what makes it a fad. People try to drift when they're ill-equipped to do it. It's a motorsport if you go out to open track days and get a feel for the car and how it reacts in grip-loss situations, then you go to drift days and hone skills... but it's a fad when people simply buy a 240 or something and call burnouts "drifting"... Also, drifting is to racing as figure skating is to speed skating...

Same goes with street racing. Simply a fad because trained drivers and grease monkies who know what they're doing will wipe the floor with the band-wagoneers...

[pimpstarr690]

Yes Drifting is a challenging sport but those D1 competitors just didn't wake up one morning and go "oh Im gonna go compete in D1 today" and does like the best drifting ever...We all know it takes practice...just as like everything else. It's either you love it or you hate it or your just messed up..lol But me and my friends drift (not burnouts) on these mean streets of Strongsville Ohio (worst place to live). Were all not even using 240's either. Were talkin' FD,Supra,Celica's.

My main purpose in doing all of this is because it's something that you really haven't seen before...I hate all that negativity b/s (I've gotten that pretty much all my life) and I just want to do something that I can say that I did. Im just gonna finally make my dream become a reality and everyone here will join me along the ride...


______________
96 Celica Convertable
~3s and AWD coming soon

[playr158]

word i can feel that, negativity my whole life also but HA now i have a hotter car then anyone ever at my HS ever had....f them alll its all about you and your mind! rock it out dude and i'm behind this mod 100%

[trdevelopment]

im just wondering if the alltrack 3sfe camery would work for a celi rear end. theres this shop by my house whose got one in the parking lot and the owner wants to sell it for liek 300$ for the whole car hes got the keys and and stuff... he said the guy who had it last never came back for it so i dont know it would be a abandon title if one would buy it off him.(im not doing the awd swap so dont flame me lol just a little pointer for you guys)

This post has been edited by trdevelopment: Dec 12, 2004 - 4:17 PM

[Kwanza26]

im just wondering if the alltrack 3sfe camery would work for a celi rear end. theres this shop by my house whose got one in the parking lot and the owner wants to sell it for liek 300$ for the whole car hes got the keys and and stuff... he said the guy who had it last never came back for it so i dont know it would be a abandon title if one would buy it off him.(im not doing the awd swap so dont flame me lol just a little pointer for you guys)
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Depends on the rear set-up. If it's a solid rear, it will probably not work because of the stroke room needed for the entire rear housing.

[FallenHero]

sell the celica and fix up the camry. WAY cooler with the sleeper factor.

ALSO!!!! Not just any rear will work. The RATIO between the front drive axle and rear must be set up properly or the car won't make it out of the garage.

This is hard to do. If they are different even just slightly you can wipe your tranny off. It'll be spitting up parts left and right. Buy the Camry and use the tranny and rear set up. Hell, that would impress me.

[pimpstarr690]

Mr.E I still haven't gotten a responce from the guy you told me that could have the stuff I need....Are you a friend to him? I guess Ill try to E-mail him again....hopefully this time he'll reply

[thedevilmaycrie]

hey pimp... i drift my ae86 and if your plannin on drifting the celica your going in the wrong direction... im not flaming you but there are things to consider... i know i was gonna do the same to my celica... first and formost the celica gt4 was awd which means that the power is split in 4 directons(100 divided by 4) which make only 50% power to rear, the only rear that has a lsd was the st205, the gear ratio for the st185 and st205 ARE different so you have to use the gt4 tranny as well(which is a lil stronger then the st185), imo as much as i hate it as a celica owner... is take the 3sgte with the 3sge altezza transmisson using the st205 rear end and make that biatch rwd only... honestly thats the best way to do it... please remeber in not flaming on you just after all research i found that out... if you have any question please pm me and ill help as much as i can...

-DMC

[pimpstarr690]

thedevilmaycrie, I understand your concern but Isn't there AWD controllers? That set's how much power goes to where...I REALLY wanna do this conversion....in fact soo bad that it's becoming a pain on why I haven't started this...I dunno...Just a thought? What's the estimated time to do the 3s swap?

[thedevilmaycrie]

yes there are awd controller... but there only for electric awd cars (ie. skylines) the awdrivetrain of the gt4 is all mechanical...

-DMC

[playr158]

yes but he can still do it, can't you custom do the gearing in the trany and such to transfer 40-60?

[thedevilmaycrie]

no... not that i know of... the skylines gtr drive system is not full time awd the system is set up so that on take off it is about 40 front - 60 rear... during normal driving the rear takes over completely until slipage occures (ie wet weather, or sliding) then the front engages to pull the car out of it... even if you set it up to awd to drift it, it still will be awd and if you think your gonna place in the top 14 in a D-1 driver search with a awd then im sorry to inform you that the odds of that are minimal... and if you take the front half shafts out for drifting then you still have the balance issues... if you REALLY want to drift the celica then your best bet is to convert it to rwd only... that means turning the engine to accomidate this... sry

-DMC

[pimpstarr690]

Well Im not gonna try to compete in D1. I know I couldn't prolly make it that far....I mainly wanted it for street use. I dont know..... =/

[thedevilmaycrie]

well dude i compete in D-1 driver searches... the only way to make it that far is by practicing and going to drift meets to get your lines down right... personally i would love to see a celica on D-1 America... but who knows if ill ever see that... i dont have the money to even try to do this =/ but ohh well ill stick to my hachi... as for you conversion if your using it for street then go awd... you'll mop the floor with there a$$... but if you wanna be able to really compete the rwd conversion...

-DMC

[Kwanza26]

Heheh... you talk guys talk about competing in D1 like it's open amaeture day at the track. D1 is the cream of the crop and you gotta get through a lot of stages before you get to D1. You can't just build a race car and automatically jump to racing LeMans right?

[pimpstarr690]

Well I know D1 is the cream of the crop.....and I definatly know that I wouldn't get that far...I'd prolly be old and wrinkly by the time I could maybe get as good as them...lol...But drifting for fun...so I'll just stick with the AWD so that I can kick some a$$ on the street....

[thedevilmaycrie]

i know that i am pit crew for a D-1 driver... and im gonna compete in my first driver search in feb... i know how it is kwanza...

-DMC