changing the head on my 95' gt? Options

[celicak]

Is there a different head i can put on this car to make it more powerful? and give it better tunability? 5s-fte or 5s-gte don't really know the difference between the two of those but any way could i change the head on my engine with another head so that way later on down the line all i'd have to do is get a turbo kit? i don't know alot about cars so as much detail as you can give would be greatly appreciated.

[celicak]

bump

This post has been edited by celicak: Jun 16, 2006 - 7:34 PM

[celicak]

maybe a 3s-ge head?

[Bitter]

what kind of power band do you want and how much boost do you plan on running? what are your goals for this motor?

[celicak]

actually i don't know my goals are to have a car that MAYBE in the mid to high 12's and at least the low 13's when all is said and done yet maintain at least semi acceptable mpg for gas. not a straight racing car just something that's pretty quick and fun to drive. i don't know what power band what would be best for this application. also i guess the boost would be determined by how much i would have to run to reach these goals.

[fastcelica20]

dont waste time messing with your celica.

3SG-TE is the way to go!

[celicak]

dont waste time messing with your celica.

3SG-TE is the way to go!

sounds AWSOME can i have the $5k for the swap? cause i don't have it but i can scrap together a few bucks to swap the heads and start to build a good engine that i can turbo later. also it would be more fun to drive for the time being.

[Bitter]

sounds like a 5sgte is what you want then, the FE head has a nice torque line on the 5sfe and is tuned for lower range operation (shines below 5500rpm). the GE head rules the upper rpm band (above 4500) and from what i understand will flow more than the FE head, but you may not get as much off the line prespool power and may not spool as low as with the F head. but if you're running the right turbo, it wont matter.

[celicak]

sounds like a 5sgte is what you want then, the FE head has a nice torque line on the 5sfe and is tuned for lower range operation (shines below 5500rpm). the GE head rules the upper rpm band (above 4500) and from what i understand will flow more than the FE head, but you may not get as much off the line prespool power and may not spool as low as with the F head. but if you're running the right turbo, it wont matter.

now would this setup give me any better performance before i turbo charge it or are there at least some performance parts i can put on it until i save up enough for the turbo kit.

[Bitter]

you'll have alot of pull begining in the mid rpms and pulling up through past the safe (sane) rpms for the stock motor. it will feel fast because about 1/2 way through the gear you'll hit the best part of the powerband. you'll loose your off the line grunt tho.

heres how it will work (from what ive come to understand)
with the G head you'll be trading fuel economy, ease of drivability, and low end power for mid and high rpm power. you'll probably see 10-30 whp gained from just swapping heads, but your torque curve will go from a nice flat line to a curve which if i had to venture a guess....peaks around 4500RPM.

[celicak]

ease of drivability and fuel economy? it sounds so bad when you say it like that...when you say fuel economy is lost what are we talking about?

[Bitter]

find somewhere to compare the same model of car with a 3sge and a 3sfe and you can sort of extend that to your situation. the F heads have a very compact chamber with narrow valve angles, all good for fuel economy and makes good low end power, the G heads have a bigger combustion chamber and wider valve angle. it'd take too long to explain the differences in each design and how it effects heat loss and many other variables.

[presure2]

the biggest thing everyone here is forgetting, or seems to forget, is to get a 5sgte to run, its basicly a 3sgte swap, and in actuality, to use the extra displacment of the 5s bottom end, you really want to be running a full standalone engine management system.
its DEFINETLY not a "budget" setup by ANY means...unless you have all the 3sgte parts, custom pistons, and someone to machine the 3s rods for free for you...

[celicak]

the biggest thing everyone here is forgetting, or seems to forget, is to get a 5sgte to run, its basicly a 3sgte swap, and in actuality, to use the extra displacment of the 5s bottom end, you really want to be running a full standalone engine management system.
its DEFINETLY not a "budget" setup by ANY means...unless you have all the 3sgte parts, custom pistons, and someone to machine the 3s rods for free for you...

and all that means? i'm new to this whole mechanic thing so basically what you said looks like how charlie brown's teacher talks. so you're saying you recommend a 5sfte?

This post has been edited by celicak: Jun 18, 2006 - 7:59 PM

[Bitter]

to do a 5sgte you'd need a clip from a 3sge car or need to source a COMPLETE head and intake manifold AND you'd need engine management.

this isnt a DIY task for you, no offense.

[ZacMan1987]

Mkay. It basically comes down to this:

The cheapest and ONLY option for now is LIVE WITH IT.

Save your money, and do a 3SGTE swap or 5SGTE swap.

Granted, a 5SGTE is new territory. You're going to have to have the entire inside of the engine redone with completely custom parts. This kind of conversion could easily run into the 10-15 thousand dollar range.

A 3SGTE swap done properly will run 4-7 thousand from what I've heard.

There is very little that can be done to a 5SFE to substantially improve its performance, short of turboing it. It is at heart, an economy engine and always will be such.

Bottom line, save your money and go turbo.

For more info, read the performance oriented stickies.

This post has been edited by ZacMan1987: Jun 18, 2006 - 8:06 PM

[celicak]

Mkay. It basically comes down to this:

The cheapest and ONLY option for now is LIVE WITH IT.

Save your money, and do a 3SGTE swap or 5SGTE swap.

Granted, a 5SGTE is new territory. You're going to have to have the entire inside of the engine redone with completely custom parts. This kind of conversion could easily run into the 10-15 thousand dollar range.

A 3SGTE swap done properly will run 4-7 thousand from what I've heard.

There is very little that can be done to a 5SFE to substantially improve its performance, short of turboing it. It is at heart, an economy engine and always will be such.

Bottom line, save your money and go turbo.

For more info, read the performance oriented stickies.

thanks that's all i wanted to know