3sgte swap compared to ... Options

[lagos]

a lot of people often ask what you can compare the performance of a swapped celica with bolt on mods to. after some careful research, i think our rival would be the stage2 sti. stage 2 on the sti consists of exhaust, boost controler at 19psi, and an ecu tune. this gives the sti about 300hp 340tq at the wheels. on the "street" this car would be dead even with a 3sgte swap with bolt on mods, at 15psi.

[Silver94CelicaOw...]

From a dig it will likely be a different story, unfortunately.

[lagos]

yeah, no doubt about that. these cars run high 12s/low 13s in the 1/4. while ours do much worse from a dig, simply due to traction limitations of fwd.

but, 90% of peoples enjoyment of the car is from a roll. so, the original post still counts as a good example of how you can expect the car to perform on the street.

[playr158]

street racing isn't condoned on this board.....nor is discussion of such

[Redline08]

its not condoned so when u talk about it just say "track" not "street"

same concept...

[BloodyStupidDave...]

street racing isn't condoned on this board.....nor is discussion of such

I don't see any discussion of street racing in this thread. Discussion of street performance of our cars, but not street racing.

[Dr_Tweak]

Wow. I can't be sure, but I think Lagos just said "stage 2". Someone's been playing too much Gran Turismo









Just playin'

-Doc

[lagos]

street racing isn't condoned on this board.....nor is discussion of such

thank you for doing such a good job at moderating the threads. now move along, because thats not what this topic is about.

[playr158]

personnally i think you might do well against a mildy (chip only) jetta 1.8t

considering i ran the same times as P2 and Def did on my non-chipped 1.8t
(14.3 area +/- .2) those are times i saw them run @ the last meet we were at
granted Jeff has hit ~13.9s a chipped jetta is there if not slightly faster

This post has been edited by playr158: Aug 6, 2007 - 10:45 AM

[2slow2nervous]

i have actually went up against a wrx a r32 vw and a 04 mustang gt and beat em from a dig. Just learn how to launch your car correctly and the celica is good to go. I am going to the track on thurs and i will post time slips up when i get back.

[lagos]

personnally i think you might do well against a mildy (chip only) jetta 1.8t

considering i ran the same times as P2 and Def did on my non-chipped 1.8t
(14.3 area +/- .2) those are times i saw them run @ the last meet we were at
granted Jeff has hit ~13.9s a chipped jetta is there if not slightly faster

what was your mph?

joel (5th guy from ctech) ran a 13.8 on his swap, and i think clayton (5th gen) claims to have done a 13.6. ill try to see if i can dig up any slips from those guys.

This post has been edited by lagos: Aug 6, 2007 - 11:14 AM

[playr158]

slips talk

What do they have done on their swaps?

6gc vs 5gc weight?

this is an AVERAGE time slip for MY jetta
specifications

tyres: GOODYEAR Eagle LS (standard touring all-season)
http://www.goodyeartires.com/goodyeartires...mp;sidewall=B01
run @ 22psi air pressure

motor: Forge MBC set for 18psi, 4 bar FPR (up from 3 bar), NON-chipped, oem exhaust



give me a set of BFG drag radials and I would have seen 14.0

[lagos]

i found joels info...

R/T .125
60' 2.055
330 5.835
1/8 8.931
MPH 79.36
1000' 11.629
1/4 13.880
MPH 100.14

link to video of run
http://www.celicatech.com/gallery/misc.php...file&i=7175
i think his car only dynoed at 200hp.

clayton claims 13.6 at 103mph. on the stock downpipe, with a 2.5in crush bent exhaust as his best time ever. but i was not able to find a time slip.

[playr158]

thats p2 and jeff....both on MUCH better tyres then the jetta was on.

figure take a base 1.8t 02+ jetta and put a chip on...should be nice a close!

This post has been edited by playr158: Aug 6, 2007 - 11:34 AM

[lagos]

here is the 1/4 of the stage2 sti.

R/T --- .838
60' --- 1.900
330 --- 5.467
1/8 --- 8.466
MPH --- 83.05
1000 ---11.024
1/4 --- 13.196
MPH --- 104.41

bare in mind that it was this drivers first time at the track.

i think what we really need to do, is compare the MPH of these cars. one car can run a more impressive 1/4, but another car, with a higher 1/4 time, could be faster from a roll. the track mph would reflect that.

This post has been edited by lagos: Aug 6, 2007 - 11:49 AM

[x_itchy_b_x]

I got back from nopi, sti's are barely breaking 100mph with high 13's low 14's. it was also sweltering out, remember temps and altitude play a good role in times.

[playr158]

i really don't think just by looking @ the MPH from the 1/4 run you are going to be able to base claims on races from a roll..

my mph is clearly lower than an STi but i can beat one from a roll...they slow after 100mph

[Defgeph]

Dan, we run our cars at Island Dragway. Its a hole in the wall track thats almost never maintained. Times are slower at this track due to poor staging conditions. If you ran your Jetta there you can easily tack on a half of a second to your run.

The reason we go there, is because we can get in 9 runs in one day not 2.

[lagos]

i really don't think just by looking @ the MPH from the 1/4 run you are going to be able to base claims on races from a roll..

my mph is clearly lower than an STi but i can beat one from a roll...they slow after 100mph

but this is a stage2 sti. bone stock, it dynoed at 259hp263tq. stage2 it did 300hp 340tq. so i think the stage2 would be faster then you from a roll.


DISCLAIMER.... when i say "from a roll", i mean, how the cars perform, on their own, after they get out of 1st gear. im not talking about anything illegal.

[playr158]

Jeff, its just an example post up a slip of somewhere else...that has a 13.6 ?!
it really doesn't matter considering the aforementioned 13.9 ? time you ran somewhere else, no?
i really don't care why you go to a certain track.

yea i think a stage2 could get MY jetta on a roll sure, but put it against a chipped jetta and i think it would be a square race.

so the bunch of Chipped Jetta/GTI, Stage2 STi, 3sgte swapped 6gc (all with standard bolts ons, intake/exhaust) should be relatively close in conditions besides the DIG where the STi gets the AWD advantage

This post has been edited by playr158: Aug 6, 2007 - 12:58 PM

[lagos]

dan, why do i always get the feeling like you try to put down any 3sgte celica, just about any chance you get?

jeff is pretty much the only 3s owner that goes to the track on a regular basis. for all we know, he could just be a horrible driver ( ), and his performance should not be the benchmark we all compare our cars to. i mean, we have jeff...and 2 or 3 other 5th gen guys. while the jetta/sti community has HUNDREDS of different cars/drivers attempting to get better and better track times.

This post has been edited by lagos: Aug 6, 2007 - 12:26 PM

[playr158]

this is a comparison thread no?

where did i say a 3sgte celica was bad?
I used jeff as the example because he so far has the criteria mentioned (swap/exhaust/BC)
and has laid down the best time so far out of anyone else on this board matching said criteria (posted)...I think thats great, i never said anything bad about it. Just what it could run against.
you said subi STi, and i added chipped Jetta/GTI....

wheres your problem?

This post has been edited by playr158: Aug 6, 2007 - 12:57 PM

[lagos]

its just the vibe i get from you, any time i say anything about a 3sgte. no big deal tho.

[playr158]

your right...i'm a 3sgte celica swap hater

thats why i'm spending thousands of dollars, building one and swapping one into my celica



This post has been edited by playr158: Aug 6, 2007 - 1:41 PM

[x_itchy_b_x]

3sgte fo' life! Dan what are you building?

[lagos]

your right...i'm a 3sgte celica swap hater

thats why i'm spending thousands of dollars, building one and swapping one into my celica

you've spent thousands of dollars?

[j0e_p3t]

i think he's doing a rwd 3s swap into a curren hatchback with a m3 bumper?

[Defgeph]

Please remain respectful, thanks.

[y2komar]

who cares. its a celica 3s. what else do you want. Anyone can go to a dealer and order a sub sti or a vw trubo.

you need cojones to get a celica 3s. no no. you cant order one in your nearest toyota dealer. And you know something, if toyota was making new turbo celicas they would be selling like hot cake.

sub or vw both give too much problems. Toyota Number UNO

[95celgt]

well i love my 3s!!!!!!
Keep in mind my 3s had a full re-build 1 year ago, and the turbo stayed the same, so abouy 77K on the turbo..no shaft play but weak spring.

The car is only runing 5psi!!!
Mods are intake/fmic, and full 2.5inch exaust..
Street Nexen rubber on 17's
Hole in the desert track with slippery pavement(more than public roads anyway)
Neck to neck with a 07 350Z

Celica
14.646 1/4
96.17 mph
2.214 60 foot

350z
14.694
95.41
2.263

Then I installed the MBC and got it to 11 psi....lost to a civic though:(

Celica
13.549
104.31
1.891 civic ran a 12.2 with an h22 n/a!!!GRRRR

[jcbass7]

well i love my 3s!!!!!!
Keep in mind my 3s had a full re-build 1 year ago, and the turbo stayed the same, so abouy 77K on the turbo..no shaft play but weak spring.

The car is only runing 5psi!!!
Mods are intake/fmic, and full 2.5inch exaust..
Street Nexen rubber on 17's
Hole in the desert track with slippery pavement(more than public roads anyway)
Neck to neck with a 07 350Z

Celica
14.646 1/4
96.17 mph
2.214 60 foot

350z
14.694
95.41
2.263

Then I installed the MBC and got it to 11 psi....lost to a civic though:(

Celica
13.549
104.31
1.891 civic ran a 12.2 with an h22 n/a!!!GRRRR

Man i want to run my car now see how the fmic, 3in back exhaust and the 8in wide tires do.. shoulda ran it at DWG!