Poorman's 3S swap, 1st Gen 3S into a Undeserving 95 ST Options

[ZGear]

Hello, my name is Ger aka ZGear from the Mid-West. Haven't really responded to this forum in all the years I've joined. Though I have supported this site in Minnesota with my 6gc passion.

My initial plans were to save up and buy a blacktop 4a, but in doing so I managed to come across a good deal on a 1st gen 3sgte locally. Whole motor without tranny and a few extra parts for a shiny nickel.

My car, stock as ever for about 5 years.



Then an exterior renovation in 2007



Also an engine face lift



This is how she sat for half a year with a case of bad crank bearing.



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Now for the good stuff:

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BCCentaur and associates: "Blizzard Tuning"



Sorry, wasn't able to do the signature Dr. Tweak pose..... , but it is shiny!
Not shown: deleted AC, power steering, and egr.



7afe Part-out time!



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What will be going in........ Da Da Dum Dum



1st Gen 3sgte with a TRD low comp head gasket. Comes with a 6GC converted harness for a GT, now all I need is motor mounts, tranny, intercooler, bov, downpipe, seals, etc......

This will be my first turbo motor and a good learning experience before I play with the big boys. I'll try to update along with the progression.

[enderswift]

cool stuff man. gonna be interesting to see how this comes out

1st gen as in st165 1st gen? how is that one different from the second and third gens?

[ZGear]

Lower horse power rating at about 190-210, what a 7afte would produce under mild boost, but with the stronger 3sgte's internal components. Single-entry turbo, but I was told that the one on there is the twin-entry from the 2nd gen CT-26. Also W-to-A intercooled and equipped with TVIS, but on this motor the TVIS was blocked off. Bunch of what I read and researched, maybe the pros will shine in.

This post has been edited by ZGear: Apr 7, 2010 - 3:30 AM

[Nartanian]

Niiice! I look forward to this.

[1Bryce1]

lol i got 3 of those engines in my shop if you need parts let me know

-Bryce

[GriffGirl]

lol i got 3 of those engines in my shop if you need parts let me know

-Bryce

Uh, where in Oregon are you?

[bccentaur3]

He will more than likely need the oil cooler stuff. Maybe the stock oil hard lines too, since the previous owner hacked that into pieces.

I honestly can't wait to see this thing up and running. It has been sitting for quit sometime. I miss the 10 feet launches lol!!!!

[rjbibeau]

i think i know who u got the motor from...did it come outta white 6gc by any chance...

[bccentaur3]

Nope a red one.

[Nartanian]

So what are the goals power wise?

[ZGear]

The stock 200 hp is good DD power for me, maybe 220 - 240 at a higher boost. Later down the road, with a rebuild and a different turbo set-up to maybe about 270-300.

[Nartanian]

500whp or bust

This post has been edited by Nartanian: Apr 11, 2010 - 9:34 PM

[EKAn]

[ZGear]

This past weekend has been glorious. Although the MN crew did massacre a 6GC, but in doing so to save the lives of many 6GCs.

Smoked Tails. Anyone Want?


Came with side skirts! Alas, my car can bling.


Big no no on hood scoop. Although I see an intercooler.


Painted GT Alloys


Oh my! A second gen 3S. Unfortunately a mr2 owner will be getting this. There was rod-a-knockin.


Could of done a better job with the ground wire tuck.


AFm just flopping around the engine bay with a plastic bendable pipe.


Greddy Type RS Bov for the taking.


Hacked igniter


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MN 6GC crew at it. RunningLow, Muggs, and BCCCentaur. (not shown: ZGear "taking some pics")


Someone's Molded project becomes my worst nightmare project. Had to grind the paint and bondo to bare metal and fiberglass. The screws also were not the very best at come off again. By pulling a bit too hard the skirts did start to crack, still rebuildable.


About another 10 minutes into it with no progress.....hmmmmm I wonder why.


What!!!! Polyurethane was a pain to break off from the body.


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Auto To Manual


Shifter Assembly from the donor car


Drilled clutch pedal and mounted


Drilled master cylinder and mounted


Shifter cables over and out


This post has been edited by ZGear: May 5, 2010 - 6:54 PM

[bccentaur3]

Just beautiful. All that is missing is the Doctor tweak pose. We are going to have you do that tomorrow.

[1Bryce1]

lol i got 3 of those engines in my shop if you need parts let me know

-Bryce

Uh, where in Oregon are you?

Portland

[RUNNIN-LOW]

well done!!!!!!..hey when did u take that picture!

[pagii]

dude u guys made my day haha cant believe there is 6gc tuners so close! im here in wisconsin and will be doing a swap very soon hopefully a meet in the near future! have fun with the swap guys!!!

[njccmd2002]

So who was the owner of the donor car?

[bccentaur3]

Runnin-Low's buddy I guess.


The 2nd gen spun a rod in the donor car.

So Zgear (Ger) will be installing the gt front spindle to accommodate the GT front brakes. And he will also be using the rear discs for his ST too.

GER, I'm waiting for you to drop the harness of to me lazy ass!!!

[SwissFerdi]

What did you do with the rear lip, because isn't that a rare Eurou version?

Good luck with the swap.

This post has been edited by SwissFerdi: Jun 18, 2010 - 12:15 PM

[OOBE]

Good luck with it, brother. No worries about the 3S being a GEN1. When you replace internals, turbo, and supporting mods, it's all fair game. Hell, I'm worried about my GEN3. I keep reading everywhere how the block is weaker than the previous generations. I compared them and it's indeed thinner. I've read how it cannot hold 600 HP before cracking (seems like BS to me, though), which is my goal and all my mods except the turbo are capable of much more than that.

Are you leaving yours stock?

[celiracer]

No that is a VIS 404 rear lip.. Same as what i have on my car.

[ZGear]

dude u guys made my day haha cant believe there is 6gc tuners so close! im here in wisconsin and will be doing a swap very soon hopefully a meet in the near future! have fun with the swap guys!!!

There's plenty of guys in Wisconsin that mods too. Yeah it'd be cool to see all the northern Midwest people meet up. Minnesota's 6GC club is slowing dying, but there's a few loyal ones. Give it time and people will have their projects up and running again. We'll gladly give you a helping hand, especially Blizzard Tuning aka BCCentaur & Associates.


This post has been edited by ZGear: Jun 22, 2010 - 12:15 AM

[ZGear]

What did you do with the rear lip, because isn't that a rare Eurou version?

Good luck with the swap.

The whole lip kit was molded on so good that it's impossible to save anything. I was able to get decent shaped side skirts, but it's deformed and only looks good from 10-15 feet. I'm trying to learn fiberglassing and will probably try to repair it.

The rear lip on the other hand was filled with polyurethane and then applied it the the rear bumper. I'll most likely crack it if I try to wedge it out.

[ZGear]

Good luck with it, brother. No worries about the 3S being a GEN1. When you replace internals, turbo, and supporting mods, it's all fair game. Hell, I'm worried about my GEN3. I keep reading everywhere how the block is weaker than the previous generations. I compared them and it's indeed thinner. I've read how it cannot hold 600 HP before cracking (seems like BS to me, though), which is my goal and all my mods except the turbo are capable of much more than that.

Are you leaving yours stock?

Thanks for your kind words. I've been beat up years after years about how I kept saying that the 7afe was a great motor. I literally pushed my motor for the past 7 years and then 2 years ago with bolt-ons it finally gave way. With decent maintenance the 7afe is like an old dog hanging on with it's life. It's common sense that the 7afe is not good with straights, but it's fair games around the twisties. Like my buddy Lou always saying, it's a stock car with a driver mod.

So now going to the 3sgte, and chosen a 1st gen, I've had people telling me why not a 2nd gen. I love the 7afe and I know I will love a motor with 100 more horsepower, plain and simple, and also it was a deal I couldn't pass up. I've considered to run stock for atleast 6 months and see if any gremlins shows up. I'm just trying to get the motor up and running and don't wanna spend extra dollars just to find that the motor is bad on the first start-up. It'll just be a good tune-up.

[Nartanian]

Have you considered stock with some E85? You'll gain power just running that gas, and there is plenty of station in MN for it too.

This post has been edited by Nartanian: Jun 22, 2010 - 10:54 AM

[Johnnyny]

Have you considered stock with some E85? You'll gain power just running that gas, and there is plenty of station in MN for it too.

wouldnt he have to upgrade fuel system partially ?

[Nartanian]

Yea, and since he's coming from an ST, he has to upgrade regardless.

This post has been edited by Nartanian: Jun 22, 2010 - 11:48 AM

[ZGear]

He won't be able to do it on the stock 440 injectors. Unless he is planning on making huge power, theres no need for e85

oops sorry accidentally posted on Gers account lol.

[Nartanian]

Oh man. Either way still cool build.

[cheela]

glad to see some mid-west members in here. nice build can't wait to see it done.

[ZGear]

So while I sit back in my chair and realized that I'm almost at the end of the road with collecting parts for my 3sgte swap with some exterior goodies as well. I just realized that I still have to search and place order for gauges, gauge pillars, bov, radiator, axles, caliper sliding bracket, piping, oil hard lines, etc...... I guess the list just keeps growing and I keep falling back on how far I still need to go. To make it worst, I'll have to wait for my next paycheck for more money.

No pics yet, but I have made some progress.

F1 Racing Stage 2: heard mixed reviews about it, cheap and I thought I'd give it a try.
AutoGrimming 2.5in Downpipe: Heard that Ebay brand ain't so bad after a long hour of polishing the passage tube.
An Unknown brand compact intercooler with a thick core: Donated from my friend since he owed me money.
Ebay Lower Gasket Kit: Maybe should of went OEM?
Ebay Timing Belt and Water Pump Kit: Maybe should of went OEM? Price is very steep just for the tensioner and idler from Toyota hence why I thought I'd give the Ebay brand a try.
Autozone Rotors and Pads: Just a cheap set-up to warm the engine up before any major brake overhual.
Tweak'd 255 Walbro Fuel Pump
Also some exterior MODs I'm not disclosing information for now.

That's that so far as much as I can remember.


I do have some questions about this build though:

Should I cough up the money and buy a Koyo or look for other alternatives like; Megan, Mishimoto? (I couldn't find one for 94 99 celica), Godspeed, or those made from China (lol, very cheap ebay brand)?

Also the same question for a BOV. Cough up the money or go EBay cheap.

Then there's the intercooler piping question. Where should I look to buy pipings? Ebay? Also if anyone has any opinion on intercooler piping set-ups, measurements, etc.

This post has been edited by ZGear: Sep 16, 2010 - 1:08 PM

[Culpable04]

radiator go cheap (OEM replacement will do the job ), BOV you need a quality one.

and for the record, I have a F1 racing clutch disc mated to a ACT heavy duty pressure plate and I've been beating the crap out of it for a month now ( after broken in ) and it's a great clutch so far, the ACT heavy duty pressure plate is.. well, not the best for big traffic jams ( first hand experience, or first leg ? )
mine is a Stage 3 disc, and mated to teh Act PP, they rated capable of handling 499 lbs/tq

for a budget minded BOV go with a 3sgte stock one, they are cheap !

This post has been edited by Culpable04: Aug 24, 2010 - 7:17 AM

[mak5603]

I have an aluminum radiator on my 1st gen 3sgte in my alltrac that I bought from ebay and it is pretty high quality, especially compared to OEM believe it or not. But besides that, I think you need to start shying away from the ebay parts. Definetly don't go cheap on a BOV, I assume you want it atmospheric as well instead of recirculated, which is why you dont want stock? I have a Greddy one that isn't recirculated on my alltrac and as cool as it sounds, it gives the car some issues running wise. Just some things to think about I guess. Good luck man, I look forward to some updates.

[bccentaur3]

Noooooooo Not the ebay water pump.... Anything other than OEM water pump it will leak and have fitment issues.

No need for a BOV compressor surge sounds better.

[block]

can't wait to see the end result, looks like a nice build.

and NEVER go cheap, ger. once something breaks, it's gonna be expensive to replace.

[ZGear]

Thanks for the input Culp and Mak5603.

Noooooooo Not the ebay water pump.... Anything other than OEM water pump it will leak and have fitment issues.

No need for a BOV compressor surge sounds better.

Lol..... I guess I should of said that I was going to sell the ebay timing belt and water pump and get oem ones. This was the only way for me to get a cheap tensioner and idler pulley set. Although further inspection does show that the timing belt doesn't have much wears on it.

[bccentaur3]

Better safe than sorry brothaman.