Evolving into a Celestial Dragon, a 3SGTE Swap (Pictures in Album) Options

[Soulend]

Hey everyone,

I finally got my 3SGTE engine and am finding my self both excited and over whelmed. I don't know much about cars, but I'm wanting to work and learn for this beautiful car. so I'll post pictures and questions about the process. so with out further adu...

3SGTE Swap Pictures

Tell me your opinions, and what to look out for!

Thanks,
Soul

[Smaay]

i hope you didnt pay too much for that. it looks pretty rough and beat up

[Soulend]

I didn't pay to much no... under 2K. besides rust on things i plan to replace, plastic and tubes are things I'm not to worried about. I'm in constant communication with the seller who, so far seems willing to help with replacing parts. my friend is going to let me borrow an engine stand so I can comb over the engine.

Soul

This post has been edited by Soulend: Apr 25, 2010 - 12:07 PM

[Smaay]

i recommend tearing the engine down and doing a full refresh. look ay mt 7A-FE rebuild thread. lots of pictures and details.

This post has been edited by Smaay: Apr 25, 2010 - 11:02 AM

[Soulend]

hey everyone,

can someone tell me what this is?

Broken Part

Thanks,

Soul

[Remy]

Thats the PCV valve.

[kavy]

that seems to happen often.i went thorough the same.try looking for a gen 2 3sge PCV valve.its fully metal.a bit longer in length but stronger and it does the job.

[Soulend]

okay cool guys thanks!

Soul

[Soulend]

Behold! the rebuilt Turbo!





The guys at AZ Turbo did an amazing job. and only for $200!

next is replacing the timing belt (yay fun!) the putting it all back together.

A few questions though, Since this is going into an ST I know I have to replace the engine mount. do I also have to replace:
accel cable?
Shifter cables? (one guide mentioned this)
CV Half shafts?
also should (have to?) I use a 5S-FE clutch and pressure plate?

what Gauges do you recommend for this swap? IE Boost guage, Oil pressure guage...

Soul

This post has been edited by Soulend: Jul 25, 2011 - 6:31 PM

[Stambo]

yea i'm half way through the process of swapping a 3sgte into my st.

You need the shifter cables for sure, gt tranny, throttle cable. The rear trans mount off your old st trans will work with the gt trans. You just have to get ahold of the right bracket that mounts onto the transmission.

You gotta get new axles for sure too. Just get the gt axles and your good to go. As far as the 5s-fe clutch and pressure plate, dr. tweak sells a good clutch that fits perfect on the 5s tranny. You just gotta use a 3s flywheel.

[Soulend]

Thanks for the info Stambo, Maybe you could help me out here and there.

Also does anyone know where I can get a Crankshaft seal?

This post has been edited by Soulend: Oct 3, 2010 - 12:05 AM

[Soulend]

okay! an update,

so I have pretty much every part I need (minus a inter-cooler reservoir, but I can pick that up locally) just got an update with the Wiring harness I sent to Tweak'd should be getting that back soon, and practically everything is back on the engine.

I'm seriously excited about finally getting this thing in the car. bad news, which some of you might know, the 1.8 in the car just finally gave out a couple weeks ago. I've had to let it sit for a bit, but this week I'll be tearing it down and get it ready to tow up to Phoenix where I can get more help from some friends and the extra tools Ill need to get it in and such...

now that I am about to finally put the engine in the car, what should I look out for?
what vacuum lines, on the car can I use?

any last minute advice?

Thanks
Kevin

[Johnnyny]

can you give me more specs on the rebuilt turbo?

[Soulend]

hey everyone,

I got my wiring harness back from Tweak'd and man am I impressed! thanks to everyone over there for helping me out with this!

this weekend I am going to try and get the engine in, and running. I'm really needing the support, and prayers that can be offered haha. I'm absolutely sure the engine will run, but I just hope I'm not missing something small.

I will admit this is the first time I've done something like this, so I'm expecting little annoyances to pop up as I run through it.

Thanks for the help I've been getting, and I hope you guys can help somemore!

Kevin

This post has been edited by Soulend: Jul 25, 2011 - 6:32 PM

[Soulend]

Moved my Celica from here:

to here:


Ill head up to my friends house Thursday night and start work on the car... hopefully I can get it done by Sunday.

wish me luck

Kevin

This post has been edited by Soulend: Jul 25, 2011 - 6:33 PM

[Bigblock]

Sounds like you have your hands full!!
Yup, I wish you luck!!!!

Since it's cooled down from 100's to the 99's ( haha )
I hope some of your friends are willing to help---

[Soulend]

heh yeah its been hot, part of the reason why it is taking so long, my friend cant handle the heat sometimes, so his project car is taking a bit longer so he had to finally move his out of the way so i can work on mine. he, and when my other friend (owns the Taco) is out of work are both willing to help... Tomorrow, Ill try to get the beat up 4AFE (poor thing) out and clean the engine bay while my friends are at work. then when able try and get the engine Friday and Saturday... If its done and in saturday, Ill try and get the exhaust put on, or I'm towing it home Sunday :\

all and all its going to be a lot of work!

Kevin

[presure2]

good luck bro!

[mak5603]

good luck bro!

x2

[Soulend]

haha thanks guys!

I know this is pretty much a stupid question, but how bad would it be to run the car for a few minutes with just a downpipe?

I'm having a local shop install the new system in for me... they are going to do it for pretty cheap, but they will not just sell me the kit. they want to make it for the car, which is fine. but I probably wont be able to do it till monday or wednesday...

I just to test it, and see if its running okay and take it around the block a couple of times...

[mak5603]

It will be really, really loud open down pipe.

[Soulend]

yeah... haha I will make sure to have earplugs... but really will it damage the engine? like the valves or turbo?

Kevin

[Culpable04]

the car will be fine, it'll be loud but who cares, enjoy it lol.

some people have driven around for weeks with just downpipe.

[mak5603]

Yeah, I was going to say, it's Just like the Honda people who drive around open header for the entire existence of their car, haha. Only thing is open header Honda's sound like awful farts and open downpipe just sounds ridiculously badass, like a race car, haha.

[DEATH]

the car will be fine, it'll be loud but who cares, enjoy it lol.

some people have driven around for weeks with just downpipe.

I've done it many times
don't wait for a exhaust to enjoy your work
Hell when I built my 5S-FTE I went around open DP for a week till I could get to the exhaust place.

This post has been edited by DEATH: Oct 14, 2010 - 1:50 PM

[presure2]

haha thanks guys!

I know this is pretty much a stupid question, but how bad would it be to run the car for a few minutes with just a downpipe?

I'm having a local shop install the new system in for me... they are going to do it for pretty cheap, but they will not just sell me the kit. they want to make it for the car, which is fine. but I probably wont be able to do it till monday or wednesday...

I just to test it, and see if its running okay and take it around the block a couple of times...

it'll be fine.
god awefull loud, but fine.

[Soulend]

Haha sweet, yeah if I can get it done by Saturday, ill take it up to an exhaust shop and get the work done, other than that it will have to wait till Wednesday when the guy in my town gets the right connections... thanks for all the help...

So I have the engine ready to be pulled when my friend gets home from work tomorrow... then its going to be a long dash through the night. then test it when its done!

Well I can't think of any questions yet but ill post them when thbey come a long.

Thanks for the help
Kevin

[Soulend]

Hey, actually I totally forgot about spark plugs, is there a set I can get from a local autostore? atleast somethign I can get the car running on until i can order ones from a provider you suggest?

Thanks for your input.

Kevin

[Culpable04]

NGK BCP7ES

go to your autozone / napa / advance auto parts and get some of these.

[Soulend]

Culp to the rescue! haha Thanks man..

Okay, workin on the axels finally got the axle nuts to come off, next are the control arms...

[Soulend]

okay i got them off a while ago, but now i cant get the rear engine mount off... and that one is annoying... and suggestions?

[Soulend]

okay! got it off engine out, moving on

[chacha]

gotta take off the 2nd down pipe....held by 3 bolts....and dismantle the cat covert off...then take off the middle crossbar member with the rear mount on....make sure you undue the bolts of the rear mount on the tranny off first...good luck ....twist and turn and angle that middle bar out...require two people..just in case you get tire

This post has been edited by chacha: Oct 15, 2010 - 9:44 PM

[KAOS]

Any updates at all?

[Soulend]

Hey, so yes some updates,

Last weekend I started it, and had to stop because I didn't have the right mounting brackets (right mounts wrong/no brackets) so I started up this weekend again thanks to Manny quickly sending me the correct brackets....

however, after spending 12 hours on trying to get the engine in... we had to stop... everyone was tired, and I was mostly extremely frustrated...

so if you can help me that would be AMAZING... I'm really at a loss at what to do... I have like NO room on either side of the engine bay... here are pictures to help explain...

first off this shows the PITA mount that is causing all the effin problems:

here you can see the the mount is to far to the right side and needs to move more left... but that is impossible... because there is no room left for it to move that way. im actually worried about the belts and pulleys shown here:


this shows you how far off the front is as well:


and I don't want to talk about the rear mount... the only 'good' thing about that, is the bracket is around it...

so I have NO CLUE what to do... Id rather not back it out for a third time... but if you have another clever way to do it and make it work Ill effin do it like right now... I'm pissed and irratated at this thing... "Labor of Love" my ass, this is a nightmare! heh...

Hope to hear from you guys soon!
Kevin

This post has been edited by Soulend: Jul 25, 2011 - 6:40 PM

[Stambo]

your using a gt trans right? I had no problem at all getting everything to correctly mount up.

[presure2]

i need some CLEAR pictures, taken from directly above the mounts.

when i install these setups, i usually lower the motor into the car using 16 chain links on the drivers side, and ~5 on the passanger, and get the tranny down and under the frame rail.
once its there, i put the drivers side tranny mount into the frame rail bracket, then raise the tranny into place with a jack and install the bolts that hold the mount to the tranny bracket.
then the passanger side mount you can just raise the engine into place, the mount should fall right into place with a bit of wiggling, then the front and rear by rotating the motor.
take the front to back crossmember off, support the motor, take the passanger mount off, and start again.

[njccmd2002]

do not tighten the gt drivers side mount to the tranny until you have centerer the mount to the body.

Same will prbably go for the other mounts.

Got to giggle them. They will fit. Same thing happenend to me when i dropped the gt tranny to fix the clutch..

[Soulend]

so... Im starting to wonder if there is something wrong with the transmission mount... EVERY other mount is in and attached... not that one...

not sure,

Kevin

PS yes, it is a 5SFE Trans

This post has been edited by Soulend: Oct 24, 2010 - 2:35 PM

[Soulend]

hey everyone,

here are some clearer pictures of the engine, mount, bracket, and mounting points on the transmission.

there are slits in the mount because my friend thought it might help to get the thing mounted, I plan to eventually getting it replaced, but for now I just want to get the thing mounted correctly...

Ill be taking pictures of the other mounts tomorrow, but if you can see something that doesn't look right with the bracket, or bracket mounting points please let me know
Kevin

[Soulend]

This is with the transmission jacked up:



Kevin

[Araykhel]

Got to say, though I know a minimal amount of actual the inner workings of a car this thread was a lot of fun to read through. Wish I had the tools/ garage to engage a project like this.

[presure2]

just to add to the info here, kev told me today in the chat that his tranny is out of a 93 camry, technicly that would be an s53, right?
i wonder if he needs a 5th gen tranny bracket as well?
i sent him the tranny bracket off of my S54 (i used the 205 mount and bracket and modded the 205 bracket to fit my S54 tranny when i swapped)

[mak5603]

hmm. Sorry for going OT, but I'm going to be using a 1996 camry transmission with my 3s, that is an s54 isn't it?

[Johnnyny]

if its a v6 model no dats an e153 if its a 5s model than yeah

[Soulend]

it would have to be a v6, reading up they didn't make a 5sfe for the camry after the S53

I can't find any brackets around here i think ill have to buy a new one...



also, do you know where these are ment to be connected?



I think i know where the second goes... but its broken

KEvin

[presure2]

its hard to tell where exactly you are taking those pics, but it looks to be the powersteering idle up valve hoses.
it basicly created a controlled vac leak when your steering wheel is at full lock so that the idle dont dip.
the car will start and run fine, as long as you plug the hoses.
i think i have one of those valves in the garage i could send out to ya if you want one.
replacing it with the motor in the car will be a bit of a hassle, but its doable.

[mak5603]

if its a v6 model no dats an e153 if its a 5s model than yeah

I'd know if I had an e153...question was more: Is my 96 Camry (5SFE) tranny s53 or s54? It was sold to me as s54, or same as celica GT. Upon further research I have discovered it is more than likely an s53 due to the fact that S53s were used in the camrys and not s54's.

[Soulend]

now, don't take this as "the gods honest truth"

but
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_S_transmission

says no... I'm not one to totally believe Wiki on information... it just might explain my problem if its true..

Kevin

[mak5603]

now, don't take this as "the gods honest truth"

but
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_S_transmission

says no... I'm not one to totally believe Wiki on information... it just might explain my problem if its true..

Kevin

Yeah I saw that earlier too. Looks like im in the same boat as you, haha..

[Soulend]

well Im ordering the brackets tomorrow, should have them next week... so Ill let you know

[mak5603]

Yeah man, any information you can give me will be GREATLY appreciated as I am doin the same thing, 3rd gen 3s with what I guess is an s53..haha

[Soulend]

so... how different are GT steering lines and ST steering lines? mine seem to be short and bent the wrong direction..

Kevin

[presure2]

kev, tweak posted in his thread about using the ST high pressure line from the pump to the rack, maybe PM him for some info.

[Culpable04]

I also used ST lines on my setup, you'll need to lossen the bango bolt on the pump and turn the pice where the hose connects a little toward the pass side, and it'll fit properly.


the BIG hex bolt you see on this picture



loosen that one and rotate the fitting so the hose can reach, that's all I needed to do for mines to work.

[Soulend]

okay i'll try that...

also, I'm not sure where these two plugs go:


I also tried cranking over the car just to see if it would... I got nothing... also when i put the key into the start position, I don't get any oil/check engine/ ect lights except seat belt and door open lights... I checked, and even replaced some fuses with ones i knew worked... I'm not sure what else it could be... I AM holding a negative to the post... not sure if that's it though...

Kevin

[presure2]

the 2 blue plugs, one is for the TVSV (factory boost controller) the other is for the charcoal canister.
make sure the EA1 plug in the fuse box is fully plugged in and locked down, and that all your grounds are properly connected. (most importantly is the one on the back of the intake manifold, but you need at least 2 more from the engine/tranny to the chassis as well)

[njccmd2002]

this bracket is no the one you need, the bolts are placed in a different spot. Just looked at my bracket and way different.

[Soulend]

thanks Manny,

so this is what my TVSV looks like:

so I either need a new one (suggestions to get one?) or i need to delete it... to which i need to know how...

also Manny, do I NEED a Charcoal Canister with a plug or can I just skip that?

Thanks njccmd, if you have a picture that would be awesome.

Kevin

[presure2]

you can delete both.

[Soulend]

Well Id like to keep the TVSV if I can, if someone has an extra please let me know,

okay so... I tried again to get the car to turn on... same thing... no warning lights and wont crank

I unplugged the 3s ECU, and plugged in the 7A just to see if the lights would come on... same thing nothing. so I hooked everything back up. and triple checked the fuses... nothing is blown... I'm really at a loss now.

Kevin

okay so update:

what works:
Dome, dash lights (when lights are on)
head lights low and high
running lights
hazards

what doesn't:
turn signals
wipers
revers lights
radio
clock
effin engine...

also... I noticed the pump has a plug (duh) I don't where I find the male plug for it...

This post has been edited by Soulend: Nov 2, 2010 - 12:43 AM

[easternpiro1]

so I have NO CLUE what to do... Id rather not back it out for a third time... but if you have another clever way to do it and make it work Ill effin do it like right now... I'm pissed and irratated at this thing... "Labor of Love" my ass, this is a nightmare! heh...

Kevin

kevin, i must commend you. ive glanced at this thread before but just now read in detail. look forward to your first day getting the car rolling! it will be a feeling like no other!

btw... that labor of love rant was hillarious! keep at it man! you can do it!!!

This post has been edited by easternpiro1: Nov 2, 2010 - 3:22 AM

[Culpable04]

Did you plug the relay on the side of the ECU ?

and how was your interior wirign done ? clutch start switch bypassed or not ?

[presure2]

lmao, i told ya to make a list!!!
i have a TVSV for you. your bov should arrive tommorow.

[Soulend]

quick update needing to run to school like now so ill get back to you,

I have a Code alarm in the car, it was in there with the 7A. it hasnt been working either... not sure if this would cause a problem,

also windows don't work but electric locks do.

Kevin

[Batman722]

make sure the 3 interior plugs are plugged in secure.

[njccmd2002]

for comparison



you can see some slight differences.

[njccmd2002]

i take that back, huge differences..

[KAOS]

i take that back, huge differences..

Ooooh oooh, uh, how about; one has an engine attached to it??

[Soulend]

update!

first off, yeah njccmd huge difference haha that SHOULD fix the problem.

also, KAOS, I think,,, his is attached to a trans with no engine

good news! not sure what fixed it, but added another ground, and I noticed around the big gray connection under the wiring harness there was a white thing... I was like okay? and pulled the gray plug out and moved it.. and i noticed it locked down the plug... not the alarm comes on the radio, and other things... i turned the car on, no warning lights but the fans came on. still don't have turn signals but ill worry about that when its going down the road.

tomorrow I'm getting a new starter, and clutch line so ill try to crank it then

Kevin

[njccmd2002]

keep us informed

[Soulend]

now... I just need to figure out how to get the driver side axle in...

do I need the C clip on the driver side axle? i think its stopping it from going completely in...

Kevin

This post has been edited by Soulend: Nov 3, 2010 - 10:03 PM

[Soulend]

okay, so still having problems with part stores... seems like the transmission is out to get me I swear... I'm just going to bend my own line to match the one that came off the transmission.

besides that I looks like I'm not getting spark... and hints as to why? it seems there is no spark from the coil pack(?) to the distributor

Kevin

well it wasn't originally bolt too the body because the wiring harness is proving to be extremely difficult and is either short, or too tight... I got at least one bolt on it... but still no spark...

This post has been edited by Soulend: Nov 6, 2010 - 7:06 PM

[Soulend]

okay, checked the coil pack (bolted to body.. not that it matters) with an ohmmeter, and had a range of .3-.7 resistance. which is close enough to 3.5-5.5 for me to go that its fine. checked the secondary and its reading about 12.25 I believe... and that is smack dab in the middle so its okay too...

my dad (not sure if this would work imho) tried to see if there was spark coming from the coil by taking the plug out and placing it to see if he could get a spark to jump from the coil to the plug. no luck.

I'm going to try to measure the distributor, but its kinda hard to do while on the engine.

please please PLEASE if you have any info about what could be causing no spark let me know!

Kevin

[njccmd2002]

crank sensor? not getting signal.

what do you mean by

okay, so still having problems with part stores... seems like the transmission is out to get me I swear... I'm just going to bend my own line to match the one that came off the transmission.

[Soulend]

Thanks for the reply,

Ill check the crank sensor.

and what I meant was. I went to Toyota to get a new Trans clutch line for my transmission and they actually gave me the same one on my ST Celica... not the one from the suspected 92 GT trans... so Ill just bend my own "universal" line bought from a parts store in town.

Kevin

[presure2]

Thanks for the reply,

Ill check the crank sensor.

and what I meant was. I went to Toyota to get a new Trans clutch line for my transmission and they actually gave me the same one on my ST Celica... not the one from the suspected 92 GT trans... so Ill just bend my own "universal" line bought from a parts store in town.

Kevin

there is no crank sensor on the 3rd gen, its in the distributor.

[Soulend]

well that saves me a bit of searching in the manual for it lmao. thanks Manny. I'm seeing if I can borrow an ECU from someone atm. I want to see if that is the problem...

I was told that if I'm not getting a check engine light and its not getting spark, then something is most likely disconnected along the way, and I honest can't think of anything except two plugs (TVSV and charcoal canister) which will be fixed soon. so it only brings me to think that its the ECU.

Kevin

[Soulend]

okay so my dad was messing around with a power sensor light, and we found out the little gray plug on the side of the coil pack and igniter (I believe a noise filter?) my dad checked the plug from the wiring harness and something in the fuse box would click and the check engine light would come on. at no point as the check engine light been on during the swap... could this little guy seriously be stopping the engine from getting spark?

also

when i got my Wiring harness back from dr. Tweak it didnt have the fuel relay resistor back plug... could that have been hard wired in?

Kevin

[Soulend]

Woo! we got spark!... now we just have to figure out how...

so my dad had the light sensor hooked from a ground connected to the battery, and the other in to the gray plug (thought to be the noise filter) and he turned the car over and there was spark... so he is saying either the noise filter* is bad or the fuse box isn't grounded properly...

any suggestions?

Kevin

[Culpable04]

it all comes down to grounds ! check for lose grounds, disconnected or even crack ground wires.

[Soulend]

it all comes down to grounds ! check for lose grounds, disconnected or even crack ground wires.

Ill keep looking for grounds, not sure where I'll find them heh but Ill keep looking...

This post has been edited by Soulend: Nov 8, 2010 - 9:46 PM

[njccmd2002]

honestly i dissambled my harness and inspected it all, to check for imperfections. and rewired some.

[Soulend]

honestly i dissambled my harness and inspected it all, to check for imperfections. and rewired some.

I had Dr Tweak and his crew work on it for me...

anyway its running.... some how fixed the problem I'm not sure what did it...

now the horrors of vacuum lines :\

oh btw, I know Culp said he got his ST steering lines too work, but mine don't want to work... and i seriously dont want to pay for new ones... so I got the bolt on the pump for the connector loosened so I can move it. but no matter where I put it the line will not match up... any suggestions on how to get them to mate properly?

Kevin

This post has been edited by Soulend: Nov 11, 2010 - 11:43 PM

[Culpable04]

I have to tighten my power steering belt, if I get to it this weekend I'll take pictures.

[purplegt4]

i just did mine the other day. you can twist the metal connector around. i took the hose (that goes straight up to the pump) off first, then connected the bolt with washer.

it is tough, but it will bolt on.

[presure2]

kev, when you DO get it lined up, make sure you use new crush washers.
if not, you'll have to get it SUPER tight before it wont leak.

[HectortheRican]

Just letting you know Kevin, I've been following this thread like a hawk since it started lol

[Soulend]

heh thanks guys, I've given up for now, I hurt my hand and arm too much... plus i was getting majorly frustrated... eh i have class anyway, Ill try again later.

Kevin

[HectortheRican]

That swap needs to be Rick rolled by you. You will never give that swap up. You'll never let it down. You'll never run around and desert it.

[Soulend]

That swap needs to be Rick rolled by you. You will never give that swap up. You'll never let it down. You'll never run around and desert it.

*Thumbs up!* made me lol.

so another update,

installed the new/old TVSV Manny sent me! Thanks a lot! . umm finally got the steering pump figured out, however, Stevenson, if you could still take those pictures they maybe of use for me! most of the vac lines are hooked up. just steering and the IAC I believe. I think i might do something similar to what manny did and just put a small filter in for that.

here is a video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmpNqAcbUw0

[purplegt4]

get a helper to twist the bolt while you're holding it in place.

[Soulend]

get a helper to twist the bolt while you're holding it in place.

my problem is, I'm not sure how to get it really tight haha

[Soulend]

wooot! she purrs beautifully now! Ill take a video after I go bowling with the Japanese Association (I'm a club officer) then Ill try and tighten up the steering and get filters mounted up and the inter-cooler figured out then the beast is done! well on my end anyway haha

Kevin

[HectortheRican]

AWESOME!

Can't wait

[Soulend]

As promised a video for your enjoyment!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hF5ps3pmb4o

Kevin

[njccmd2002]

nice finally

[HectortheRican]

It sounds so damn THROATY

[Soulend]

It sounds so damn THROATY

that sir... is a 3" down pipe at work lol

[HectortheRican]

Is it just the downpipe or have you connected the exhaust?