 Autocrossing and parts. |
 Feb 23, 2004 - 8:54 PM
|
 
|
|
Enthusiast  Joined Feb 21, '04 From Oklahoma Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%)  |
Are our cars known for autocrossing? I just found a Tein suspension kit and Suspension Tech sway bar set at Nopi. Is it worth getting to make our cars handle better? I know Rally was popular with the GT-4s. Is there a big difference between the two cars suspension wise? ST vs. GT-4?
|
 |
Replies
(1 - 19)
|
Feb 23, 2004 - 9:57 PM
|
|
 Enthusiast Joined Aug 29, '02 From Dallas, Tx Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Yeah, there have been several very successful 6gcelicas. As far as I know, I own the winningest autox celica, or perhaps the second. Its won 6 SCCA Solo II Stock class national championships, although not in my hands. I've come very very close to trophying at nationals with it in street touring trim.
The GT-4 was available with the superstrut suspension which is completely different than the macpherson strut system in all other 6g celicas. Many of the rally teams converted their superstrut cars back to macphersons to increase reliability. The suspension mods you're looking at will help a lot, but I would also suggest that you get koni struts to go with the springs...and i would suggest the eibach sportlines over the teins, or perhaps GC coilovers if you're really serious. |
|
Feb 23, 2004 - 9:59 PM
|
|
||||||
|
Enthusiast Joined Nov 25, '03 From Mizzeri Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Yes, both the ST and the GT have won several national championships in the stock category. EvilSpeedToe and I think they would also be good contenders in the STS category as well, though National level success hasn't happened... yet. 
It really depends on what you are after. If you only want to be competitive at the local level, you really don't need anything at all except a set of good autox tires. The 6gc celica handles pretty darn well out of the box. I suppose it wouldn't hurt to freshen up the bushings and struts and stuff, but if you are just now starting out, I would recommend going to some driving schools. Most local regions have a school at the beginning of the year, so they are probably taking sign-ups about now. You will see the most gain on course by learning. From my experience, autox is about 80% driving, 10% mental, and 10% car. Ymmv, but I think a school will pay more dividends than a suspension package... especially starting out. Now, if you are after a Divisional or National trophy, you are going to need some work. For that you are better off tossing that Tein crap in the trash and getting custom spring rates from Ground Control and custom valved dampeners from Koni. Now, honestly, I am not bashing Tein, here. They make good stuff from what I hear, but if you want that last couple tenths of a second, then you need a custom setup for an autox application. Will you see some gains on-course from a Tein kit... probably, maybe. But look, the car is great for autocrossing right out of the box. It is light, the GT has killer torque down low, and the ST has the gearing advantage for a lot of courses (that I wish I had), transitions are great, braking is great, acceleration is about as good as it gets for a one-wheel drive wonder.
I am under the impression that the GT-4s have the SuperStrut suspension, which was designed to keep the camber static while cornering. It didn't seem to work very well. Not only did the WRC cars switch to double-wishbones mid-season, but it made alignments on the street cars a real nightmare. (This is just my impression from reading about the cars, so take that with a grain of salt) The ST/GT have MacPhearson struts, which is a tried and true way to go about things. Do a search on SuperStrut if you want to learn more about the GT-4 suspension. |
||||||
|
Feb 23, 2004 - 10:01 PM
|
|
|
Enthusiast Joined Nov 25, '03 From Mizzeri Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Dang SpeedToe, you beat me to the puch by 2 minutes.
Listen to Speed, he knows his way through the cones.  Feel free to PM me if you want specifics on my setup. |
|
Feb 25, 2004 - 12:47 PM
|
|
|
Enthusiast Joined Feb 21, '04 From Oklahoma Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
I didn't know Celis were even in anything other than Rally. They do feel pretty good on turns. The weight is nice too. I just never see them on the SCCA shows. Only BMW's and Tegs and Mazda. I though Tein was supposed to be the best set out right now?
|
|
Feb 26, 2004 - 9:21 AM
|
|
||
|
Enthusiast Joined Nov 25, '03 From Mizzeri Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
I don't know much about them, other than I have heard good things from the Subaru crowd. From looking at the installation manual, they look to have 16 presets for dampening, which is cool. As far as I know, they are the only 'set' out there. The rest of the stuff I have seen is springs from this manufacturer and dampeners from another. It is nice that the set is matched, but I would be suprised if you can revalve the dampeners or change the spring rates... at least, they haven't responded to my questions thus far. |
||
|
Feb 26, 2004 - 9:38 AM
|
|
||
 Enthusiast Joined Aug 30, '02 From Michigan Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Speedvision doesnt cover SCCA solo2/autox events, they only cover SCCA touring and other various road racing events, no autocross, but i wouldnt be surprised if they started showing clips of autoX highlights when they do the SCCA runoffs within the next 2 years and JIC also makes a spring/damper combo setup. --------------------  Believer, you'll leave her, in leaving them all No but I don't buy it Like anything you do, as anyone you are Cause I'm... Ten Speed, of God's Blood & Burial |
||
|
Feb 26, 2004 - 11:50 AM
|
|
||
|
Enthusiast Joined Nov 25, '03 From Mizzeri Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Really? My buddy just bought a set from them for his Subaru RS. He called and talked to the engineers and specified his own spring rate and valving. We installed the setup this past weekend, and it made a HUGE difference in his car. The thing is, he looked around for me, and saw that they have a setup for the 5th gen and the 7th gen, but said they skipped the 6th gen Celicas... I haven't gone and looked myself, though. His JICs are top notch quality. I was impressed with everything about them except the instructions. Those suck. I would consider getting a set of JICs since I know I can get exactly what I want from them. Pricey, though. I think my bud paid $2200 for his set. |
||
|
Feb 26, 2004 - 7:12 PM
|
|
|
Enthusiast Joined Aug 29, '02 From Dallas, Tx Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
I doubt autocross will ever be truly televised. They sometimes show clips in different other shows, but thats about all there will ever be. The format just isn't interesting to most people that aren't participating.
Oh, and the runoffs aren't autocross, thats the roadracing national championship. For autocross its just the "Tirerack SCCA Solo II National Championship". What a mouthful.... Be carful comparing your buddys JICs to what we can get. There are like 6 different levels of JIC coilovers. They sell everything from cheap kits with just some shocks and adjustable perches, up to full double adjust race coilovers. But the only applications they have listed for the celica are for the lower level ones. With ground controls you can also specify your spring rate. With any other coilover setup you might be able to just buy the threaded bodies and the collars and then buy 2.5" dia race springs from Eibach for $50 a piece. If you call JIC they might be interested in making the full adjustable shock for the 6gc. If they make one of them already it shouldn't be hard to adapt the higher end ones. |
|
Feb 26, 2004 - 8:03 PM
|
|
 Enthusiast Joined Dec 26, '02 From Alabama Currently Offline Reputation: 2 (100%) |
Tanabe also makes full suspensions set ups for the 6th gen. Also, when I give my car the throttle to spin the tires, both wheels leave marks. Why is mine not a one wheeled wonder?
|
|
Feb 26, 2004 - 9:42 PM
|
|
||
|
Enthusiast Joined Aug 29, '02 From Dallas, Tx Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Tanabe makes coilvers for the 6th gen? I doubt it, but I could be wrong. Your car is a one-wheel-wonder, it just has good weight distribution (I'm guessing you're not a very big guy). Try going in tight circles in a parking lot (preferrably deserted) and see if you can spin the inside tire. I'd bet you money that you can (you have to be turning hard tho!!). |
||
|
Feb 26, 2004 - 9:54 PM
|
|
 Enthusiast Joined Oct 3, '02 From Va Team 6gc Currently Offline Reputation: 1 (100%) |
My bad i didn't read the coilover part. either way u can get their springs for our cars u can pick them up at http://www.optauto.com/webstore/ .
This post has been edited by Drocay: Feb 27, 2004 - 6:41 AM --------------------  All I have in this world is my Balls and my Word and I'm not breaking em for no one,- Tony Montana Team 6gc 2005 |
|
Feb 27, 2004 - 1:07 AM
|
|
||||
|
Enthusiast Joined Dec 26, '02 From Alabama Currently Offline Reputation: 2 (100%) |
??? what are you asking? I took off in my yard one time and left two good 'wheel spin' marks so I was like "Hey, it's not a one wheeled wonder!!! and then that guy said... and I was confused. Eh, time to go to bed. |
||||
|
Feb 27, 2004 - 9:22 AM
|
|
||
|
Enthusiast Joined Aug 29, '02 From Dallas, Tx Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
I'm telling you it has an open diff. You may be able to spin both tires under ideal conditions but try it on ice. Try it when one wheel is in oil. Try it in anything other than ideal conditions and you'll see what I mean. |
||
|
Feb 27, 2004 - 5:16 PM
|
|
 Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '04 From LA Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Pardon me if I sound like an idiot. Which wheel is it? Passenger or drivers side?
|
|
Feb 28, 2004 - 4:12 AM
|
|
|
Enthusiast Joined Apr 29, '03 From lynn,ma Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
i am pretty sure the wheel spin on the passanger side. I've seen it in ice on both a prelude and a mr2.
|
|
Feb 28, 2004 - 12:44 PM
|
|
||
|
Enthusiast Joined Aug 29, '02 From Dallas, Tx Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Whichever has the least traction. |
||
|
Mar 1, 2004 - 2:54 AM
|
|
|
Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '04 From LA Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Huh!?!? You mean the powered wheel switches!?
|
|
Mar 1, 2004 - 9:22 AM
|
|
|
Enthusiast Joined Nov 25, '03 From Mizzeri Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Yes, the power switches. The wheel with the least amount of traction is the wheel that gets the power.
|
|
Mar 1, 2004 - 9:41 AM
|
|
||
|
Enthusiast Joined Aug 29, '02 From Dallas, Tx Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
In an open diff. As you can imagine, this isn't very effective in making the car accelerate. This is the reason for limited slips. They send some or all of the torque to the wheel that grips, not the wheel that slips. They're not just for doing 2 wheeled burnouts  .
|
||
 |
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:
| Lo-Fi Version | Time is now: September 3rd, 2025 - 3:14 AM |