safc2, 7afe? Options

[Bitter]

does the apexi safc2 work with the 7afe? and do i need anything besides the unit itself? i might be able to get a slightly used one for about $150, and i'm wondering what else i'd need to make it work, how hard the install is, and what sort of gains i *could* see with the 'bolt ons' i have, those are listed in my signature. i supposed the best benefit of it would be improved fuel milage.


now, being a 93....i really dont have a good way to monitor the a/f besides my fluke meter hooked to the ox1 on the diagnostics port. but the stock O2 sensor is of course a narrow band sensor, by watching the O2 voltages could i equate those to a/f well enough to get a decent tune?

[Bitter]

fuel economy - i'll be taking fuel away during high throttle.
reliability - i wont be going leaner than 12.5:1, initially 12:1

i dont see how taking away fuel during WOT would hurt fuel economy and how leaning wot to a safe ratio would hurt relability. just becase others have damaged things with a safc2 doesnt mean i will. the difference is this....
1. i have a good understanding of knock, AF ratios, EGT's, fuel maps, and how it all relates.
2. I'm tuning it myself, so if something isnt right I can fix it ASAP
3. I'm tuning it myself with a WIDEBAND O2 sensor, so rather than just leaning it till it knocks i can actually tune for a specific ratio.



others here have used the safc2 with a 7AFE, but they were on their way to go turbo and just messing around, i dont think any were using widebands to tune by. you really cant tune without reliable O2 sensor feedback.

so you're using a piggback? i dont think its worth it for the 7afe IMHO! save up all the trouble and the $$$ for engine swap or F/I!

uhm....if i went FI, what am i supposed to use to control the engines tune if i dont use a piggy back? am i supposed to do a trans swap and get a full standalone like an EMS or a Megasquirt?

[Kwanza26]

Leaner doesn't always mean more power. 14.1-14.7 stoic is the standard for good emissions on most engines, and is the starting point people tune to... but power-wise... engines differ. Some make more power richer, some make power leaner. A lot of the newer toyota engines (1ZZ, 2ZZ, MZ, etc) typically run pretty lean. IMO... the 7AFE runs farily rich up top, and leaning that out a bit can make power... but your 12:1 is still pretty rich. If you want to tune for slightly better economy... lean out your midrange and keep your top-end slightly more rich (but still leaner than stock...)

To answer your questions... all you need is the unit and the pigtail harness. The install is easy and pretty straight forward. The stock O2 is not gonna give you a consistent reading, even at WOT, so tuning off of that isn't a very good idea. Since you mention you'll be getting a wideband... I'll assume you have an idea of what you're doing... but I'll not that there isn't much power to squeeze. 5-10whp is pretty optimistic. On the 7AFE injectors... If I remember correctly, they're 100cc or 120cc or something around there.

To close... I'll have to agree with the ones that say... don't bother. For 400 bucks you can buy a 4AGE (bigport/smallport or even silvertop 20V) and then piece together parts needed for a swap. It's really not too hard. 400.00 for a few ponies isn't really worth it to me... but each to his own. The difference in the low-end is not even noticeable between the 7afe and 4AGE...

This post has been edited by Kwanza26: Jun 30, 2006 - 6:48 PM