Need help deciding if I should sell out...., How can you put up with FWD? Options

[tin_foil]

Lately I've been getting more and more into drag racing, horsepower, autox, drifting and upgrading cars in general. And sadly, my sexy little FWD GT celi just isn't cutting it. Now I'm in a decisional dilemma. For years I wanted a celica because I still think it's by far the nicest looking car of its class. When I first got my car, I had dreams of a 3s swap, and lots of exterior mods. But no matter what, racing a FWD car, no matter how much power at the crank it's got, just can't get that power to the ground well enough. I've played with the idea of an AWD conversion with the celi; I'm not at all daunted by the work, I just don't have 5 grand(+) to sink into it. For that price, I could get a 240sx shell, and drop in a RB26DETT. (that's the skyline engine for those of you that don't know) That would be an amazing car, and it would be crazy fun to drive.

Anyway, I know some of you will say stuff about how could I betray my kind. But I'm curious to hear what those of you that are really car racers and modders say? How can you put up with a celica, no matter how much power you've got under the hood? I love fantasizing about driving up to races with a kick-arse celica, half the people saying, "what's that?" and blow everyone away,(somewhat like tufy, ) but the money required to basically do a full gt4 conversion plus suspension upgrades and bolt-ons is just ridiculous... Should I just sell the black beauty and sink my money into something that can really perform amazing for cheap? Or maybe just save up for another year (maybe more), AWD convert the celica, and get a very good(with awesome handling, and looks), but not really that amazing of a performance car?

[tin_foil]

Wow...look at the argument I started.

Okay, first off, let me say, a debate about FWD vs. RWD vs. AWD was not what I originally intended. I honestly figured nearly everyone was in agreement about the merits of RWD and AWD. It now becomes clear that some people do not have the experience to know any better, as illustrated by these comments:

seriously, I used to have a 240sx, and as fun as RWD can be. my FWD Celica handles soo much better

I've got a buddy with a 240sx with a SR20DET swap, and he thinks it's great and he's so fast. Well, from stop light to stop light, he can out run me if he shifts right. But any other racing and I would stomp his ass.

When someone says, "my celica handles better than a 240", or "my celica beats my friends sr20 240." it means nothing. Personal testimonies don't mean much with cars. Anyone can say anything, or have had an unusual experience. But here's some facts for you all that may change your opinions a little:

Here's the technical specs of a 1998 240sx, and a 1998 celica. I hate to admit it, but the 240 is better than the celica in nearly all handling, performance and aerodynamic specs. The 240 is known for its tight cornering and responsive handling.
http://www.automobilemag.com/am/1998/nissa...ifications.html
http://www.automobilemag.com/am/1998/toyot...ifications.html

Here's info on the sr20det:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_SR20DET#Engine_Specs
We're talking an engine that has about 60 more hp, and 55 more fl-lbs torque than a celica in a car thats about 250lbs heavier and RWD. Somehow I doubt a celica could beat that in every way.

Okay, now on to the discussion of drive train. I realize that there will always be some amount of preference in what each person LIKES to drive, but there are some facts that every car enthusiast should know. Comments like this simply show lack of knowledge:

With drag racing, the FWD and the RWD are pretty close to each other. AWD is the one with the handy cap, unless your talking street cars. AWD is limiting on tires you can run with 2 diffs. RWD doesn't hook up on ralley, and there aren't many cars out there that are RWD and technologicly advanced and cheap at the same time.

But you don't need to blindly believe me. Here’s plenty of articles for you all:

Here’s a site explaining oversteer, understeer and the merits/flaws of RWD, FWD, AWD. (GREAT article, once again, stuff every car enthusiast should know):
http://www.autozine.org/technical_school/h..._handling_5.htm

Here’s an entry discussing torque steer. (a FWD-only problem)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque_steer

Nothing official here, but just a couple of forum discussions about different drive trains:
http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13620
http://forum.ebaumsworld.com/archive/index.php/t-25048.html

A short article explaining traction benefits of different drive trains:
http://www.familycar.com/nextcar/Step3.htm

Well I hope you all learned something, especially bigmeanbulldog. In case you didn’t want to read the articles, I’ll just say that here’s someone who actually knows what they’re talking about:

Because FWD is designed for safety for the average driver in snow and rain conditions. Nothing else. While its kinda cool to make a FWD car fast, there are many distinctions that make fast RWD cars better. Traction, Power Oversteer, No Torquesteer, Easier to prevent understeer, etc.

Once again I will say, I realize that PREFERENCE is an individual thing, but these are simply the facts regarding FWD.

And now I can finally get on to my real point of the thread. I was really just wanting to hear the opinions of you 3s swappers, and those of you that REALLY race.(meaning on a track) Do you think it's worth it? Of course you love the celica, but how do you feel about the fact that after all that money, it’s really not amazing at any type of racing? (good at autox, I admit, but the money could have been spent better on a different car)

In conclusion, I hope I didn't offend anyone. Like I said, I didn't mean to start an argument, but it's hard for me to bite my tongue when people post BS regarding car info.

This post has been edited by tin_foil: Apr 24, 2007 - 1:50 PM