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> Clutchless Shifting, good or bad
post Dec 2, 2008 - 11:10 PM
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aww_shoook_em



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when I used to be into RSX's before, I remember coming across a media thread that had a video with clutchless shifting

out of nowhere, I asked my friend about clutchless shifting.. he told me, it kinda takes practice and its less wear-out for your clutch
and stuff.. now that Ive heard the positive things about it, I was wondering if there were bad things about it...

if theres like 2 things that are bad about clutchless shifting, then I wont trip about it.. but if it comes to more than 3+up
then Ima have to break the habit of it..

so 6gc fam, what would it be?? YE -or- NAY on clutchless shifting

(I'd rather not base this on polls because I like my information straight to the facts)


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post Dec 3, 2008 - 9:13 AM
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Dr_Tweak



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When I drive a manual I never use the clutch (except for getting going in first gear of course). I do it without even thinking now. When done properly it does not wear the clutch or the synchros in the tranny at all, but you have to perfectly match every shift. The part people forget is the rev-matching, they try to just shift across from one gear to the other without pausing in-between and rev-matching. I once wrote a guide on how to do this but I will tell you right now that it's hard to explain, you kind of need to see it done. So, if you're going to try this, it's at your own risk. smile.gif

For the vast majority of drivers out there, just using the clutch is the way to go. This is only for car people that are into this sort of thing... or for people driving a car with a bad clutch or bad synchros LOL (prodigy515, any comment?) Sorry for the spacing, this was copied/pasted from an email that I wrote.

How to shift without using the clutch. This is perfectly safe for your
car (in fact better than using the clutch) IF it's done properly. It
takes a little bit of practice, but the important thing to remember is
that it should be very smooth, if you are using a lot of force to try
to shift then you're doing it wrong.

First of all, you HAVE to use the clutch to get going in first gear,
no way around it (try to avoid coming to a complete stop). Once you
are moving in first gear, you take the tranmission OUT of gear by
first getting the engine "neutral". That means that you are neither
accelerating (on the gas) or decelerating (totally off the gas). This
normally requires giving a little bit of gas since coming off the gas
completely usually puts a reverse load on the transmission (engine
braking). Once you are "neutral", you should be able to pull the
transmission out of gear without touching the clutch at all. It should
move smoothly with no pops, clunks or grinds.

Once you're out of gear, you either need to upshift or downshift.
Either way, you must make the RPMs of the engine be whatever they WILL
be when you shift. For example when upshifting, you are driving in 1st
gear and you are at about 3500 rpm. You pull the transmission out of
gear as described in the first step. You let off the gas and allow the
RPMs to drop to about, say 2500 rpm, and then you immediately slip the
transmission into 2nd gear without touching the clutch. It should go
in smoothly with no pops or grinds, if you are putting a lot of force
into it, stop, because you're not at the right RPM. Don't be too
concerned about watching the tach and figuring out EXACTLY what RPM
you need to be at, just do it by feel and it will come naturally after
a couple times. If you miss the shift window (the tach drops down to
idle speed), then you can simply tap the gas to bring the RPMs back up
to where you need them, and then shift into the gear you want.

Downshifting is a little more tricky. You start the same way by
getting the engine neutral and pulling the transmission out of gear.
Now since you're downshifting, the RPMs need to be HIGHER than when
you pulled it out of gear. So pull it out of gear, and then rev the
engine up to about where it needs to be, and then slide the
transmission into gear. For example, you're driving along in 3rd gear
at 2000 rpm and you need to downshift. Pull the transmission out of
gear, rev the engine up to say, 3500 rpm (without touching the clutch
at all), and stick it into 2nd gear. Again, don't worry about the math
so much as the feel of it. Again, if it isn't going in and you miss
the shift window, just rev it up again to where it needs to be and
shift it in.

When you're slowing down for a light or stop sign, it may be easier to
just pull the transmission into neutral and leave it there rather than
downshift every gear. Also, if you can shift back down to first gear,
try to keep rolling instead of coming to a complete stop to avoid
having to use the clutch (just don't get caught) smile.gif

If you get good at shifting without the clutch, you will soon find
that you don't want to use the clutch anymore even when it is working
properly. Personally, I never use the clutch after first gear when I
drive stick, I'm so used to it that I don't even think about it.

It sure freaks people out when I drive their cars though!

-Doc

This post has been edited by Dr_Tweak: Dec 3, 2008 - 9:17 AM


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-Dr Tweak, 6GC's resident engine swap wiring expert extraordinaire
Click here to see my swaps
drtweak@phoenixtuning.com


Posts in this topic
- aww_shoook_em   Clutchless Shifting   Dec 2, 2008 - 11:10 PM
- - devilsden97   nay. its called RPM matching... i remember havei...   Dec 2, 2008 - 11:13 PM
- - richee3   I know that truck drivers simply don't have ti...   Dec 2, 2008 - 11:20 PM
- - x_itchy_b_x   if you can do it correctly then its fine. if you c...   Dec 2, 2008 - 11:27 PM
- - aww_shoook_em   well yeah, same here on the attempt with the 3rd a...   Dec 2, 2008 - 11:32 PM
- - richee3   Hahaha yeah, I'd destroy my trans if I tried a...   Dec 2, 2008 - 11:41 PM
- - epocsirhc   Sorry to hear about that missed opportunity   Dec 2, 2008 - 11:46 PM
- - _mikeE   Done it, i've no problems but it does kinda gi...   Dec 3, 2008 - 12:12 AM
- - stetsonaw   had a 91 ranger 5 speed i was able to do it in, on...   Dec 3, 2008 - 8:35 AM
- - GEpower   That's bad, mkay. I'd say my gearbox is w...   Dec 3, 2008 - 8:49 AM
- - Dr_Tweak   When I drive a manual I never use the clutch (exce...   Dec 3, 2008 - 9:13 AM
- - garin   probably a bad idea to shift without the clutch. d...   Dec 3, 2008 - 9:13 AM
- - samir0189   I can do this kind of shifting with my celi both u...   Dec 3, 2008 - 3:16 PM
- - Razgriz   It seems to have been answered in this thread alre...   Dec 3, 2008 - 5:03 PM
- - terbear4god4life   try not pressing the clutch down that much and doi...   Dec 3, 2008 - 6:33 PM
- - 99Celica   Good thing I work as a valet so I can practice on ...   Dec 3, 2008 - 9:09 PM
- - 97celiman   this sounds like a question for car talk guys...   Dec 3, 2008 - 9:40 PM
- - aww_shoook_em   I havent tried out downshifting.. and Im afraid to...   Dec 4, 2008 - 12:36 AM
- - 95st-celica   lol...been there done that...droped the trans and ...   Dec 4, 2008 - 1:20 AM
- - delusionz   Am I doing it right if I ... Rev through the gear...   Dec 4, 2008 - 7:37 AM
- - Dr_Tweak   There's absolutely no reason to do this when r...   Dec 4, 2008 - 8:32 AM
- - aww_shoook_em   mostly for lazy people.. xD   Dec 5, 2008 - 11:54 AM
- - tomazws   I'm chicken, I have no money to replace anythi...   Dec 5, 2008 - 2:29 PM
|- - aww_shoook_em   QUOTE (tomazws @ Dec 5, 2008 - 2:29 ...   Dec 5, 2008 - 11:27 PM
- - zero07   Tried this yesterday after reading Tweaks how-to, ...   Dec 5, 2008 - 2:51 PM
- - 99Celica   I tried it out and it's pretty easy although i...   Dec 6, 2008 - 3:41 AM
|- - Dr_Tweak   QUOTE (99Celica @ Dec 6, 2008 - 3:41...   Dec 10, 2008 - 8:16 AM
- - RickJamesBish   Does this really make any sense for everyday use? ...   Dec 10, 2008 - 4:13 PM
|- - presure2   QUOTE (RickJamesBish @ Dec 10, 2008 - 4...   Dec 10, 2008 - 4:14 PM
|- - richee3   QUOTE (RickJamesBish @ Dec 10, 2008 - 4...   Dec 10, 2008 - 5:37 PM
- - 99Celica   QUOTE (Dr_Tweak @ Dec 10, 2008 - 9:1...   Dec 10, 2008 - 8:48 PM
- - samir0189   I wouldn't say its a good way to drive around ...   Dec 10, 2008 - 9:12 PM
- - nics   tried practicing it for left foot braking. still g...   Dec 18, 2008 - 2:01 PM
|- - aww_shoook_em   QUOTE (nics @ Dec 18, 2008 - 2:01 PM...   Dec 18, 2008 - 10:29 PM
|- - nics   QUOTE (aww_shoook_em @ Dec 18, 2008 - 7...   Dec 20, 2008 - 9:53 PM
|- - aww_shoook_em   QUOTE (nics @ Dec 20, 2008 - 10:53 P...   Dec 22, 2008 - 12:00 PM
- - Hanyo   no clutch = good double clutch = good single clut...   Dec 19, 2008 - 3:21 AM
|- - Dr_Tweak   QUOTE (Hanyo @ Dec 19, 2008 - 3:21 A...   Dec 22, 2008 - 8:44 AM
- - jimmykay   I was playing around with this over the weekend a ...   Dec 22, 2008 - 9:19 AM
- - Dr_Tweak   Sure Yeah I might have forgotten to mention that...   Dec 22, 2008 - 10:06 AM
- - stetsonaw   double clutching? looost.   Dec 22, 2008 - 10:10 AM
- - Tigawoods   the funniest thing happened the other day (i forgo...   Dec 22, 2008 - 7:15 PM


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