 3sge-5sfe, opinons? |
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 Aug 16, 2004 - 12:41 AM
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Enthusiast  Joined Apr 22, '04 From illinois Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%)  |
Please tell me quickly if i'm wrong, but here we go. And i want opinions about what people think of my personal idea. I'm pretty darn sure that i've read that the 5s-fe is a watered down version of the 3s-ge. Now if this is true, i want and need to know, what is watered down about it, what's different. And then here's where i want to get it to, if there isn't a whole lot of difference as in the bolt on capabilities of the two engines (watered down), would i be able to lightly modify, if i have to modify the R.I.P.P supercharger to the 3s-ge?
alright, we'll start from there. --------------------  The most important lesson I learned from Karate-Dō Kyōshan – “You can not be what you do not believe you are” |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 12:48 AM
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 Administrator Joined Aug 23, '02 From Seattle, WA Currently Offline Reputation: 14 (100%) |
The two engines have different blocks and heads, and are very different internally. I think the supercharger would require a lot of modification to fit the 3S-GE.
-------------------- New Toyota project coming soon...
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Aug 16, 2004 - 12:49 AM
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Enthusiast Joined Apr 22, '04 From illinois Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
you have any ideas about what that would mate up with easier (stronger engine than the 5s-fe)
-------------------- The most important lesson I learned from Karate-Dō Kyōshan – “You can not be what you do not believe you are” |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 12:52 AM
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 Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '04 From LA Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Actually coom, the two engines aren't that different....
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Aug 16, 2004 - 12:58 AM
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Enthusiast Joined Apr 22, '04 From illinois Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
haha, damn shid, don't tell him, tell me, tell me!!! hahahaha
-------------------- The most important lesson I learned from Karate-Dō Kyōshan – “You can not be what you do not believe you are” |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 12:59 AM
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 Enthusiast Joined Dec 27, '03 From Nor Cal Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Actually shid... they are... -------------------- "It's ok to be naked girl... I'm an artist!"
1995 AT200 Celica ST: stocked out daily driver... 1984 AE86 Corolla GT-SR5: silvertop 20V 4AGE project car jacked up with goodies... 1991 SW2x MR2 n/a: bare bones hardtop model soon to be... |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 1:02 AM
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Enthusiast Joined Dec 27, '03 From Nor Cal Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
I think it's time to do a bit of research. It's better to figure things out for yourselves (cause i'm tired of explaining stuff over and over). Research is part of the fun... aside from that... catch me on a good day and I might just explain... again... why they are similar... and why they are different. There are soooo many more differences than there are similarities... so aside from some mounting positions, bolt-patterns, recycled block design, etc... they are completely different...
-------------------- "It's ok to be naked girl... I'm an artist!"
1995 AT200 Celica ST: stocked out daily driver... 1984 AE86 Corolla GT-SR5: silvertop 20V 4AGE project car jacked up with goodies... 1991 SW2x MR2 n/a: bare bones hardtop model soon to be... |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 1:03 AM
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Enthusiast Joined Apr 22, '04 From illinois Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
dang people, don't start this crap on my post. Kwanza, please explain to me what you think of my idea, and then some. And the difference between the two engines, like, right down to it.
-------------------- The most important lesson I learned from Karate-Dō Kyōshan – “You can not be what you do not believe you are” |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 1:04 AM
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Enthusiast Joined Apr 22, '04 From illinois Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
i rather personally hear it from you kwanza, i've kinda figured you know a lot more engines than others.
-------------------- The most important lesson I learned from Karate-Dō Kyōshan – “You can not be what you do not believe you are” |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 1:10 AM
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Enthusiast Joined Dec 27, '03 From Nor Cal Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
*sigh*... ok Umm... the only similarity is the block, and even that is just similar. It's based off of the same design (water jackets, stud points, etc...) but the block itself, is mostly different (taller deck, bigger bore, bigger block overall). Bore is different... stroke is different, crank, rods, pistons, are all different. The head is COMPLETELY different. It's a GE head, wide angled driven by two Cam gears... not just one. 1 gen 3SGE uses TVIS, which has big ports and TVIS butterflys on the intake manifold, while the 2nd gen 3SGE eliminates the TVIS butterflys, uses smaller intake ports, higher compression, and a different intake manifold design. The 3rd Gen 3SGE eliminates the shimmed head design, increases compression, uses slightly better valvetrain design and a slightly different cam set-up. The 4th Gen is the redtop BEAMS 3SGE which again, wears a completely different head from the previous... which utilizes VVT-i on the intake side. The 5th gen 3SGE (what I call it) is the blacktop BEAMS 3SGE, which is similar to the redtop, but also utilizes VVT-i on the exhaust cam. These are all completely different, from top to bottom, to the 5SFE. Only similarity, is moutning position... -------------------- "It's ok to be naked girl... I'm an artist!"
1995 AT200 Celica ST: stocked out daily driver... 1984 AE86 Corolla GT-SR5: silvertop 20V 4AGE project car jacked up with goodies... 1991 SW2x MR2 n/a: bare bones hardtop model soon to be... |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 1:13 AM
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Enthusiast Joined Apr 22, '04 From illinois Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
tell me more about this red top and black top, and then a supercharger integration
-------------------- The most important lesson I learned from Karate-Dō Kyōshan – “You can not be what you do not believe you are” |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 1:18 AM
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Enthusiast Joined Dec 27, '03 From Nor Cal Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Redtops and Blacktops are expensive and very hard to come by. They're not boost happy motors either, each at around 11:1 or so compression. Either way, I don't know of a supercharger kit for the 3SGE head, which is completely different on the intake side compared to the 5SFE. It's possible, but it'll be a custom job unless you happen to find some remote Japanese kit. Either way, a custom kit would require things like, s/c pulley, a supercharger, possibly a custom intake manifold, lines, piping, sensors, etc... won't be an easy job... RIPPMODS makes a Supercharger kit for the 5SFE... -------------------- "It's ok to be naked girl... I'm an artist!"
1995 AT200 Celica ST: stocked out daily driver... 1984 AE86 Corolla GT-SR5: silvertop 20V 4AGE project car jacked up with goodies... 1991 SW2x MR2 n/a: bare bones hardtop model soon to be... |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 1:23 AM
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Enthusiast Joined Apr 22, '04 From illinois Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
yeah, i know that ripp makes that kit, and what a wonderful kit. Bolt on 100 hp, stock everything. that why i was wondering if there was a way i could bolt it to a stronger based engine, i'm just ready to take things to another level.
-------------------- The most important lesson I learned from Karate-Dō Kyōshan – “You can not be what you do not believe you are” |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 1:32 AM
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 Enthusiast Joined May 15, '03 From Aurora IL Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
good idea, i hear what you're saying.. if you're going to go that route, you may as well just get a 3sgte.. you know? supercharger would be nice, tho. i still have yet to see anyone on this site with one of the RIPP kits. it's a shame, as i understand it, they put a lot of time and money in to developing it. |
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Aug 16, 2004 - 10:39 AM
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 Enthusiast Joined Nov 27, '03 Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Just keep in mind that Toyota has had so much time in developing their engines its not even funny.... why do you think they last so long? The engines are near perfect as they are... I say that going the 3sgte route is the best way for your reliability, durability, performance, and potential. I understand that you want something that is original that no one has done before but, often times its better to blend in with the crowd than stand out like a sore thumb. I can see what you are wanting to do here, but doing a fully custom job with out a TON of research not to mention troubleshooting, is going to land you in more trouble than you started with. Kudos on the idea, I just personally wouldn't attempt it because of all of the time involved. I can justify the time spent on an engine swap that is completely feasible and proven to work than to do something like that and turn out to be totally wrong. When you have your own custom shop and have taken every class offered at colleges on automotive and custom designing, then I can see doing this but......yeah sorry for the rant its just how I feel about it.
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Aug 16, 2004 - 1:03 PM
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Enthusiast Joined Apr 22, '04 From illinois Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Haha, at least i got a good idea and kudos remark. And personally, i hate the 3sgte, everyone that has a little bit of money (you all know what i mean) goes right for the 3sgte. If you knew me personally, i'm not that type of person. But hey, thanks everybody. And anybody elses comments are welcome, and Kwanza, i still would like to hear more from you if you have anythign else to say.
-------------------- The most important lesson I learned from Karate-Dō Kyōshan – “You can not be what you do not believe you are” |
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