7A-FE's Maximum HP, Read on... Options

[Batman722]

a true gt4 will beat the junk out of a fwd celica.

A GT-4 would spank almost any turbo Celica, be it a GT or an ST, because its got the AWD

A swapped FWD Celica would beat a GT-Four in a strait line.

A GT-Four would beat any Celica in a curvy track or rally stlye race.

I would buy a GT-Four whatever it takes if I had the opportunity.

[Kwanza26]

A swapped FWD Celica would beat a GT-Four in a strait line.

A GT-Four would beat any Celica in a curvy track or rally stlye race.

I would buy a GT-Four whatever it takes if I had the opportunity.

Quite the opposite in fact. Even though the FF Celica would be lighter... traction issues alone ensures the AWD win. Think about it... you gotta have the right set-up and the right technique to even touch the low 14's to high 13's mark at 12-15psi but with a stock 3SGTE (CT26 or CT20b)... versus a stock ST205... the AWD can match FF even with the extra weight. A good stock comparison would be the Eclipse GS-T versus the Eclipse GSX. The GSX is faster because of traction off the line alone... even though both cars have the same power and the FF car has the weight advantage.

On the track... it's up to the driver... but I'd argue the ST205 is a good track car... but isn't the most agile. I got a lot of heat for saying this in the past... but I would still say the ST205's weight will hurt it on a tight curvy track more than an FF car... and since the FF car has the same engine with potentially the same power... it'll only have more power to the ground. These cars are driven very differently on the track... but weight matters more on a track than the drivetrain set-up especially when the cars make around the same amount of power.

*edited to be more clear. I was thinking two things and once and it came out wrong...;]

This post has been edited by Kwanza26: Dec 9, 2005 - 1:23 AM

[Defgeph]

I did a 13.9 @ 12psi with my FWD 3sgte.

[Batman722]

I disagree.

GT4WRC ran a personal best 14.14
http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30188


Defgeph ran a 13.93 (swapped)
http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30206

presure2 ran 14.07 (5sfte)
http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30799

[Kwanza26]

I did a 13.9 @ 12psi with my FWD 3sgte.

You wouldn't even believe how many guys I know with FF 250+ whp turbo cars that can't break 13's... hehehe. It comes down to doing it right... but simply put... AWD is easier.

[Defgeph]

Yes, I do agree AWD is easier. but I do believe that a swapped 3sgte fwd would take a GT4 in a 1/4. Unless someone can show me a stock ST205 that can do a mid 13 second run.


DEF

[Kwanza26]

Yes, I do agree AWD is easier. but I do believe that a swapped 3sgte fwd would take a GT4 in a 1/4. Unless someone can show me a stock ST205 that can do a mid 13 second run.

No they don't... closer to mid-low 14's... but comparing stock boost vs stock boost... they're very close. Take that... then throw in the average driver with normal tires on both cars and the AWD will be significantly faster. There's a learning curve to drag racing a powerful high torque FWD car... most people can't do it without a lot of practice on an actual strip.

[Kwanza26]

I disagree.

GT4WRC ran a personal best 14.14
http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30188


Defgeph ran a 13.93 (swapped)
http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30206

presure2 ran 14.07 (5sfte)
http://www.6gc.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30799

Heh... my opinion VS yours... but those times are damn near identical when you look at them from a race perspective. Side by side racing... all of those cars are nose to nose. 0.1 seconds is about a bumper or a slighlty slow shift...

[Batman722]

well in theory, if you had a stock 205 vs a swapped 205 and put them against each other at the same boost, tires, conditions, ect.. the swapped would be faster in the 1/4 mile.

now, Jeff ran a high 13 with a 185 (which as we all know is about 20 less hp than a 205) and GT4WRC ran a low 14...

If someone swapped a 205 in their 6th gen, they should have better times in the 1/4 mile.

of course, it's all opinions untill it is proven

This post has been edited by Batman722: Dec 9, 2005 - 1:12 AM

[nik]

but did defgeph run his time on slicks? on stock tires for each car i think the st205 would do better but its just IMAO but man i WOULD love to buy the st-205

This post has been edited by nik: Dec 9, 2005 - 3:45 PM

[97sccelica]

I did a 13.9 @ 12psi with my FWD 3sgte.

yea, but you also dont have a 100% stock setup

yes, you have only the 185 motor, but you have full exhaust, light weight flywheel, and upgraded clutch. More than likely, your car is putting a good amount more power to the wheels than a stock GT4

less weight and more power to the wheels, your car should easily beat a Gt4 from a 10mph roll and up and from a stop, unless the GT4 is driven perfectly, there will be a point where your car would pass it

high power FWD annoys me after a while. i drove my friends turbo vtec prelude a couple of times. it made 180whp before putting the turbo on, so if i had to guess, it probably had 230-240whp(going off the acceleration my car had back then). 1st gear was useless. second would spin unless you were gentle with shifting and the throttle, third would spin if you shifted hard enough. it was fun, for a short while, then it got tiring not being able to use the full potential of the power it had.

now my WRX, with a gentle launch, i get 1.8 60ft times. and this is with the stock, balding tires. and before you think, big deal, its awd, think again. i can roast all four tires on bone dry asphalt if i wanted too. i literally launch the car at full power, thanks to the two step launch control. i just floor it and wait for the lights to drop, in the mean time, the car is at 10psi of boost while standing still. and thats when i dont use the nitrous.

the sti 6spd swap should be done today hopefully, if not, early next week(waiting on parts). i plan to take the car to LACR asap and see what kind of 60ft's i get with the new ability to launch hard. plus i will actually be able to shift fast and hard for once.

im hoping for a 1.6xx 60ft, but i have a feeling my stock clutch will be the limiting factor

[Batman722]

but did defgeph run his time on slicks? on stock tires for each car i think the st205 would do better but its just IMAO but man i love to buy the st-205

no, Jeff ran that time on street tires, not slicks.

[lagos]

I did a 13.9 @ 12psi with my FWD 3sgte.

why were you only at 12 psi ? i thought you ran 15 all the time

[presure2]

I did a 13.9 @ 12psi with my FWD 3sgte.

why were you only at 12 psi ? i thought you ran 15 all the time

cause he has an EBC

[lagos]

I did a 13.9 @ 12psi with my FWD 3sgte.

why were you only at 12 psi ? i thought you ran 15 all the time

cause he has an EBC

yeah i know, but im just trying to understand why he would turn his boost down from what he normally races at

[nik]

but did defgeph run his time on slicks? on stock tires for each car i think the st205 would do better but its just IMAO but man i love to buy the st-205

no, Jeff ran that time on street tires, not slicks.

that awesome

[Defgeph]

Yes 13.9 was on street tires

Art at the time i didnt have 15 psi dailed in correctly. My gains were off a bit, I would hit 15psi then shoot up a little an hit fuel cut. I Normally keep my car at 12 psi. I like the way it feels at 12 psi, I'll turn it up to 15 when I need it though.

I know my car isnt stock, but it still has less HP than a stock st205. I would still think that in a race, a celica with a swapped 205 motor would beat a st205 in a straight line.