Black top head on a red top beams? |
Black top head on a red top beams? |
Apr 23, 2013 - 2:12 AM |
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Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '13 From New Zealand Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Does anyone know if this is possible or has been done before?
Not saying I want to do it this was just a drunken idea the other night Would be cool running the dual vvti though, and you can find the heads reasonably cheap here in NZ Had a quick look but didn't see anything obvious but could be using man eyes haha Have also heard you can modify 4age itb's to fit the 3sge? -------------------- QUOTE (madbeardo @ Mar 27, 2013 - 8:17 PM)
When said about modification I didn't mean the ones made by man. What I said was that it might have modified after being affected by a certain force. |
Apr 29, 2013 - 4:08 PM |
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Moderator Joined Nov 5, '07 From New Zealand Currently Offline Reputation: 3 (100%) |
it is possible to put a blacktop head on a redtop. however fitting it into a ST20# celica is another mission, due to
more room required for the vvti camgears, which would go into the strut tower and engine mount customised the wiring so you can run the ex. vvti oil drain from the head as the redtop is on an angle the blacktop is straight there are no gains from swapping the cams over as they are apparently the same size which are IN. 226@ .50"/1mm, EX. 222 @ .50"/1mm its not a very cost effective move, best to look into a stand alone ecu + tuning, but even then your looking at the range of 3-5,000 NZD most likely. There is an auusie guy Glenn Booth who makes itbs for the beams, but I think your looking at around the 3,000NZD mark? -------------------- |
Apr 29, 2013 - 10:29 PM |
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Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '13 From New Zealand Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Ah, so you couldn't swap the black top exhaust cam into the red top head and run a standalone ecu?
Probably a silly question but forgive me i'm new This post has been edited by Mo_tron: Apr 29, 2013 - 10:30 PM -------------------- QUOTE (madbeardo @ Mar 27, 2013 - 8:17 PM)
When said about modification I didn't mean the ones made by man. What I said was that it might have modified after being affected by a certain force. |
Apr 30, 2013 - 2:47 AM |
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Enthusiast Joined Apr 24, '08 From Orange County, CA Currently Offline Reputation: 33 (100%) |
Go to the beams section of the mr2 forum boards. Its anothrt forum. Type in veams redtop forum in google search.
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Apr 30, 2013 - 4:57 AM |
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Moderator Joined Nov 5, '07 From New Zealand Currently Offline Reputation: 3 (100%) |
well if the camshafts are technically the same spec, whats the point in swapping them?
another problem you'll run into is how to control the new vvti camshaft, as the beams rely on an oil control valve to adjust the timing of each cam pulley once you have a look and compare the redtop cam pulley's and the blacktop pulley's I think you'll understand what I'm talking about, check TM for altezza's and notice how big the cam pulley cover is don't worry these aren't silly questions, its all about learning and getting an understanding also I like your avatar picture of the beams, looks a lot nicer than Bonzai's -------------------- |
Apr 30, 2013 - 12:14 PM |
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Enthusiast Joined Apr 24, '08 From Orange County, CA Currently Offline Reputation: 33 (100%) |
haha hey now no picking on me although it's true. dual vvti is better for outputting power. but toyotat went with vvti on exhaust side for emissions. check out this website :
http://www.mr2.com/forums/beams-owners-group/ -------------------- For Sale Items:
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Apr 30, 2013 - 4:48 PM |
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Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '13 From New Zealand Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Haha thanks guys, looks like I have a little more reading to do now
Also thanks to your cold air box sticky Rusty I will hopefully be building one very soon, but what did you do with your MAF? My old man just got an over the radiator intake on his commowhore and they can tune the standard ecu to run MAFless, can we do the same or did you just add it into the new piping? -------------------- QUOTE (madbeardo @ Mar 27, 2013 - 8:17 PM)
When said about modification I didn't mean the ones made by man. What I said was that it might have modified after being affected by a certain force. |
Apr 30, 2013 - 5:02 PM |
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Moderator Joined Jun 29, '08 From Denver Currently Offline Reputation: 59 (100%) |
Haha thanks guys, looks like I have a little more reading to do now Also thanks to your cold air box sticky Rusty I will hopefully be building one very soon, but what did you do with your MAF? My old man just got an over the radiator intake on his commowhore and they can tune the standard ecu to run MAFless, can we do the same or did you just add it into the new piping? Rusty has a 3rd gen 3S-GE, not a BEAMS. The MAF is the alpha and the omega on a BEAMS, and you cannot alter your intake much, nor can you do anything with the factory ECU. The factory ECU has extremely tight tolerances on the MAF and loses power when you alter the intake much, or just won't run right at all. With a standalone, your options are much much wider. -------------------- "Employ your time in improving yourself by other men's writings, so that you shall gain easily what others labored hard for." -Socrates. Even Socrates told us to use the search button!
2006 Aston Martin V8 Vantage. 1998 Celica GT- BEAMS Swapped. 2022 4Runner TRD Off Road Prenium. 2021 GMC Sierra AT4. |
Apr 30, 2013 - 5:34 PM |
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Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '13 From New Zealand Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
Aw man
Thanks for the heads up though I was about ready to go so you've just saved me a lot of head scratching and swearing! -------------------- QUOTE (madbeardo @ Mar 27, 2013 - 8:17 PM)
When said about modification I didn't mean the ones made by man. What I said was that it might have modified after being affected by a certain force. |
Apr 30, 2013 - 5:41 PM |
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Moderator Joined Jun 29, '08 From Denver Currently Offline Reputation: 59 (100%) |
You could get the SARD Sports+ intake and build a custom box around it.
-------------------- "Employ your time in improving yourself by other men's writings, so that you shall gain easily what others labored hard for." -Socrates. Even Socrates told us to use the search button!
2006 Aston Martin V8 Vantage. 1998 Celica GT- BEAMS Swapped. 2022 4Runner TRD Off Road Prenium. 2021 GMC Sierra AT4. |
Apr 30, 2013 - 8:30 PM |
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Enthusiast Joined Jan 8, '13 From New Zealand Currently Offline Reputation: 0 (0%) |
So leave the stock piping? Or can I put the MAF into a stainless set up and go from there?
-------------------- QUOTE (madbeardo @ Mar 27, 2013 - 8:17 PM)
When said about modification I didn't mean the ones made by man. What I said was that it might have modified after being affected by a certain force. |
May 1, 2013 - 2:55 AM |
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Moderator Joined Nov 5, '07 From New Zealand Currently Offline Reputation: 3 (100%) |
Thanks, that thread is a good read. Yes I'm running a 3rd Gen 3S-GE, which has the MAP sensor.
My take on the matter is, when you start using aftermarket air intake/filters on the beams engine, you also increase turbulent air flow. Which is too erratic for the maf to pick up. People have tried a few things such as different air filters, the size piping and even a honeycomb thing to try and straighten the air flow. But overall factory and the SARD filter works best. and 71mm piping bonzai? You could try a trd panel filter which will fit the factory box. If you were looking at building a cold airbox, see what other people have tried with the beams, what worked, didn't work etc. Try different ideas, such as placement of the maf, size piping and stepping down the size and ways of straightening the airflow. and then see what results you get on the dyno. -------------------- |
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